Did Nancy Pelosi jump the gun by launching impeachment inquiry before release of Ukraine call transcript?

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Did Nancy Pelosi jump the gun by launching impeachment inquiry before release of Ukraine call transcript?

The White House releases the unredacted text of President Trump's phone call with Ukraine's leader; reaction and analysis on 'The Five.'

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," September 25, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

DANA PERINO, HOST: As reporters always do, they hope the president will stick around and take a couple of more questions, but he talked for almost 50 minutes there at the U.N., at the U.N. General Assembly. The president wrapping up. This is the final day.

He's met with lots of leaders. He said he worked morning till night as he fights back against the Democrats' formal impeachment inquiry, while all these other things were going on. This high drama coming after the White House released an un-redacted transcript of Trump's phone call with the president of Ukraine.

It shows Trump asked about looking into Joe Biden and his son's business dealings, but there was no direct mention of military aid. Also breaking this hour, Congress has now received the official whistleblower complaint and is currently reviewing it. We've got some pent up commentary to get to. Greg, let's go to you first because we didn't get to hear from you yesterday.

GREG GUTFELD, HOST: That's true. I was sent home like a child.

PERINO: You have all these great notes.

GUTFELD: I am glad that the Dems and the media, you know, finally got to the impeachment. It was like watching Sam and Diane on Cheers flirting for three years to get to it, and finally they got into bed and they impeached like rabbits. But it might have been a good idea to have waited until the transcript came out, because when you look at it --

JESSE WATTERS, HOST: They pre-impeached.

GUTFELD: They pre-impeached. You look at it, it's a phone call in front of witnesses where one guy is asking another guy about something that happened in the past that you can look into, which I think is in his job description to ask about corruption. No wonder the transcript suddenly isn't enough. Oh, my God, we need something else, because they screwed up. Almost went in the wrong direction with that verb.

Anyway, I love how the Dems said that we didn't arrive at this conclusion lightly. No, you arrived at this conclusion three years ago. You've been pounding it into the ground ever since. The media cites a growing clamor, right? A growing clamor for impeachment. They are the growing clamor for the last three years since Trump was election. They act like they're a model of restraint that this was the last straw. No, every day for the past three years has been the last straw.

So what I say is the country right now is a victim of impeachment harassment. The media expects you, the viewer, to have a heart attack every freaking week. Every time they come up with a new bombshell, they want you to rife in terror. But our viewers, and the people at home, and the voters, know better than this. There's a disconnect between the way America is and the way the media portrays it, right?

Americans are starting jobs. There's low unemployment. They've got swollen IRA's. They're spending their money. But the Dems, they can't profit off that. The media can't profit off that. So they have to paint an apocalypse.

The viewers should be outraged that they're putting through an unhealthy emotional rollercoaster every single day. But I know that they get it. They've always been way ahead of us on this stuff. They see it for what it is. It's not left versus right. It's not conservative versus liberal. It's the media versus you. And they hate you.

PERINO: All right. There was a lot --

GUTFELD: Sorry, I had to get it out. Look, I was home yesterday, OK?

PERINO: President all day, John, you'll wrap this up for us, thank you. John? Hello, John? John?

JOHN ROBERTS, CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Dana. Sorry, it's a little noisy here. I didn't hear. I'm sorry. Can you repeat the question?

PERINO: I was suggesting you could wrap up the press conference for us, and maybe just the week because it's been quite a one -- it's only Wednesday.

ROBERTS: Well, you can see that it was sort of airing of grievances here by the president. It almost felt like Festivus there for a little while. The president saying that he had all these accomplishments this week at the United Nations, and yet they went unreported because everybody was focused on this idea of impeachment, which we should point out is not an insignificant things. The fact that this is only the fourth time that a president in the history of the United States has faced impeachment proceedings, definitely carries with it a measure of significance.

The president talking about his phone conversation with Volodymyr Zelensky, the two of them also had a bilateral meeting. The president saying that he can't believe that the Democrats are going down the road of impeachment over what was discussed in that phone call. Both the president and President Zelensky, earlier today, saying that there was no pressure put on the call. But, clearly, the president did have a couple of asks, one, in which he characterized as being a favor. He asked Zelensky to look into this whole idea of crowd strike and alleged interference in the 2016 election on behalf of Hillary Clinton by elements in the Ukraine.

And then the other one, separate to that, which wasn't characterized as a favor to look into Joe Biden. The president also suggesting that if Democrats want a transcript of the first conversation that he had with Zelensky after he won the presidency they are welcomed to that as well. And the president also talked about transparency in terms of this whistleblower complaint. I'm told that the complaint is on Capitol Hill, and the question is whether or not the president will actually seek to have that declassified and made public. That may be part of that call that he made with Leader McCarthy about transparency. So, we'll see, Dana. Still a lot to come in this.

PERINO: All right, John. It's been wonderful to have all of you in New York, and I mean that.

ROBERTS: It's been good to be here.

PERINO: All right, thank you, John. Jesse, you have some thoughts?

WATTERS: I just can't believe we have a Cheers and a Seinfeld reference right at the top of the show. An unbelievable show already. I think this bottomline the Democrats are trying to impeach Trump for crimes that they themselves committed. These are nasty, ruthless, destructive, hypocritical people. And it's going to take a lot of energy to fight back their deceit and their lies. But you know what, Dana? I'm up to the challenge. And I will do this for the American people because they are being lied to.

This is what the bottomline is, Donald Trump has taken a sledge hammer to the ruling class, and the ruling class is fighting back hard as hell, and they're never gonna stop. He beat back spy gate, the Russia hoax, he exposed Hillary, all of her corruption, and now he's beginning to expose the Biden family corruption in Ukraine, and in China, and they want to impeach him for exposing Biden's corruption.

This is what's going on. The left says they don't believe what Biden did, abusing his power, abusing taxpayer money, and his son enriching himself is a crime. They think it's a crime for Trump to say, hey, can you look into that? Because Donald Trump is the chief executive of the executive branch of this country, and he is in charge of executing the laws. So, if some American citizen is committing potential crimes in the United States, or overseas, he has the right to say, hey, guys, can you look into it?

But the Democrats are saying no, no, no, no, no. Joe Biden and his family, they're above the law. Joe Biden can't be looked into by this current administration, and he can't be look into by the Ukraine administration. So, Joe Biden, basically, gets a free pass. He can run around and commit all sorts of crimes because he's just above the law. And to say that this administration can't enlist an ally to look into potential corruption of a political opponent? Hmm, isn't that exactly what the last administration did? The last administration enlisted multiple allies, including Ukraine, to look into Trump and all of his people on no basis, with no evidence.

Yet, this time the evidence is right in front of us. We have Joe Biden on tape and we have his son's receipts. So, at this point, the Democrats are accusing Trump of crimes they committed and this is in order to get out in front of the Durham investigation, and the Bill Barr investigation. It's an admission they can't beat Trump at the ballot box. And this is Nancy Pelosi trying to ride this crazy impeachment train the best they can.

But you know what's going to happen? Sadly, coincidentally or not, Joe Biden might take the fall for all of this.

PERINO: OK. I'm going to have to stop you there for one second. We're gonna come right back for more commentary. But first, let's go to Mike Emanuel because the whistleblower complaint it is now up on the Hill. Mike Emanuel, have you seen it? Have you been able to break it down for us?

MIKE EMANUEL, CORRESPONDENT: No, not at all, Dana. It is here on Capitol Hill, but it is inside what is known as a skiff here on Capitol Hill. A sensitive compartmented information facility, and so you have members of the House and Senate intelligence committees going in to get a look at this document, the whistleblower complaint, and get, you know, break it down a bit for themselves. But when they've been coming out they have said absolutely, positively nothing, which is pretty common when you have the intelligence committee members going into a sensitive facility, they don't want to be caught talking on camera when they're on the way out.

Bottomline, it's been pretty stunning how quickly things have moved here. Yesterday morning you had the Speaker saying that something had changed, that it was a time for a formal impeachment inquiry. So the president then said fine, you want the transcript of this phone call with the Ukraine president? I will release it. Then Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer said I want more than that, I want the whistleblower complaint. So 10 o'clock this morning, eastern time, you had the president hand over the full transcript of that conversation. And at 4 o'clock this afternoon, now the whistleblower complaint is up here on the Hill. Dana?

PERINO: All right, thank you, Mike. We appreciate it. We'll catch up with tomorrow. There's a hearing tomorrow at 9 AM with the director of National Intelligence, the acting director, Joseph Maguire. Juan, do you think that the Democrats should have waited until they'd seen the transcript and the whistleblower before they moved forward as Nancy Pelosi did last night?

JUAN WILLIAMS, HOST: No. I think that based on what we know and what has been proven, in terms of the release, it's not a transcript, per se. It's more a memo written of people who understood or heard the conversation. I think that they were exactly right. You know, today, apparently, the White House talking points got leaked to some Democrats. But I think it's leaked farther --

PERINO: They weren't leaked. They were accidentally emailed to them. That's not leaked.

WILLIAMS: Well, yeah, accidently. They didn't intend, so I guess it was leaked. But I think, you know, just listening here, I think, boy, those talking points, they've made the rounds because the reality is --

GUTFELD: What does that mean? Whoa, whoa, whoa. What does that mean? Are you saying I got talking points, Juan? No, you got to answer to the answer. You got to answer to the accusation.

WATTERS: I was told what to say --

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: All around --

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: You had a whole day to talk. Let's get Katie in, and see if she has something to say that's original.

WILLIAMS: Here we go. Asking a foreign government to investigate --

GUTFELD: Unbelievable.

WILLIAMS: -- a political arrival is illegal. It's illegal. It's a violation of the constitution --

GUTFELD: Did you get that from media matters, Juan?

WILLIAMS: And the constitution --

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: -- the president should protect and defend the constitution of the United States. And by the way, this isn't just me.

WATTERS: So he's supposed to look away for potential corruption?

GUTFELD: No, you can't because you accuse us of reading talking points.

WILLIAMS: Here's what it is. Judge Napolitano who's our senior news analyst, he says -- what does he say? You don't need a quid pro quo, you just need to ask a foreign government --

WATTERS: Did you get the Napolitano's talking point now, Juan?

WILLIAMS: This not only that, I mean, you stop and think about. Pelosi says this is lawless. Mitt Romney said extremely -- comes from a Republican --

GUTFELD: Of course.

WILLIAMS: You get a situation where the President of the United States is saying I want dirt on my political opponent. And then I hear, oh, it's because we can't beat you at the ballot box? It's because he's worried about Joe Biden. This, to me, is outrage and it's unbelievable that people would try to throw --

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: Juan, you got two days to talk about it. Katie hasn't been able to say word.

WILLIAMS: Oh, yeah, Mr. Filibuster.

KATIE PAVLICH, HOST: Two things --

GUTFELD: You were on this show yesterday, we weren't, Juan. You had your shot.

PAVLICH: Let's talk about two things that you brought up. You said that it's illegal for a president to ask for dirt, but from a foreign agency or a foreign government. Senate Democrats sent a letter to Ukraine in 2018 asking for them to investigate President Trump by cooperating with a special counsel investigation. So, if Trump is guilty of it, so are the Democrats. You also --

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: Let her talk, Juan.

WATTERS: Juan, did you read the transcript or not? It doesn't seem like you did. Sorry, Katie.

PAVLICH: No, I'm good.

WATTERS: Go ahead, Katie.

PAVLICH: All right. So you implied that the transcript was not properly transcribed. The people who wrote the notes were CIA agents who were brought in from a CIA to do this. We know that people who are -- have done these things before have said on record today that this is the closest you're going to get to a transcribed --

PERINO: Yeah, they're not taped.

PAVLICH: So, onto the political aspect of this. You know, the word favor has been tossed around a lot in terms of the transcript. People accusing the president of giving a favor and asking for a favor of Joe Biden being investigated. He actually uses the term favor when he's asking about -- Ukraine interference in the 2016 election. And let's not forget that it was the DNC who went and met with Ukrainian officials in Washington, D.C. to ask for dirt on President Trump on behalf of Hillary Clinton. That's the first thing.

The second thing is the president this week has been able to set up a huge contrast when it comes to what Democrats are focused on and what he is doing. He's been meeting with a number of leaders. You had Secretary Pompeo stand up and say we've convinced a number of allies that the Iran deal is no longer the way forward with Iran. So while he's doing this on the world stage and having serious conversations about the security of the country, the Democrats are focused on impeachment based on a transcript that they didn't even see until today and continuing on with the narrative, while the president is actually focused on serious issues that affect the country. And voters are going to be the ones who decide if that's going to happen.

PERINO: Well, last month -- I can't remember which poll it was. But it's pretty much consistent across the board that 60 percent or more of people say they are not for impeachment, that they don't have the appetite for it because they would like to see other things get done. And I do wonder, Greg, about the Democrats, how do you make a message to the people that it was worth it to put you in power to deal with healthcare, and get deals, and get things done with the president if, in fact, you don't have anything to show for it.

GUTFELD: They're doubling down on a pair of two's, right? This is cognitive distance. Remember, that's born from studying a cult. Like, what happens when the leader's predictions don't work, don't pan out on doomsday? The followers just double down. So what you're seeing is you're seeing the Democrats continually saying that there's going to be an impeachment. There's going to be impeachment. Why is that? Because they cannot lose their psychological investment in this battle.

Yet, meanwhile, they're totally ignorant to the rest of the country that do not want impeachment, which -- and the country that is booming. People are starting businesses. You know, like I said, they're spending their IRA's. People are actually getting along unlike five years ago. Relatives are getting let out of jail thanks to Trump. People are having -- it's great - - it's easy to get along when you have jobs. And this is what the Democrats want you to ignore, and what the media wants you to ignore.

PAVLICH: Well, I think on the Biden angle, too, the question -- why is Joe Biden even in this conversation? The New York Times published that story about him bragging about getting the prosecutor fired in May of 2019. Trump talked to the president of Ukraine in July. Short couple of months later, that's why he says, there's stuff going on in Ukraine about the prosecutor that's possibly why he brought it up in the conversation. But the question of Biden is, was he selling influence through his son to get access to the White House and Washington?

It's the same reason why Hillary Clinton had a lot of trouble with the Clinton Foundation, and why the Clinton Foundation completely dried up as soon as she wasn't elected president. She got a lot of checks that came through when she was the secretary of state. The same questions that apply to her selling of influence in that situation, also apply to Joe Biden and the vice presidency, which is why you're seeing outlets like the RNC calling for him to release the transcripts.

WILLIAMS: But, Katie, can I just -- first of all, everybody has looked into this Joe Biden thing and nobody has --

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: No, no, Juan.

WILLIAMS: No, seriously. Nobody found anything, and yet all of these conspiracies --

WATTERS: What do you mean no one found anything? What does that mean?

WILLIAMS: Let me finish. This is, to me, this is like an intentional act of distortion in order to defend the president. This is not -- I mean, it's not about Joe Biden.

WATTERS: It's not?

WILLIAMS: If anything had been found that was illegal the you say, OK, well, here's what it is. No, this is all speculation. What this is about is a phone call that the President of the United States placed in which he says, you know, we've been very good to you over in the Ukraine, can you do me a favor? Can you interfere in American politics?

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: He said that? I didn't see that in the transcript.

WATTERS: Say Donald Trump flies over to the Ukraine because he's the point man on the diplomacy over there, and at the same time Trump Jr. goes over there and gets some nice job bringing home 50K a week, or whatever it is, at the same time your dad is wheeling and dealing on energy deals. You think that's OK? Let's just -- like a difference between the Trump Jr. situation and Hunter Biden, OK?

WILLIAMS: Oh my gosh.

WATTERS: No, because you brought up the fact that Hunter had a crack pipe found on him the other day.

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: I'm going to leave that out for argument sake. OK, Juan? When Donald Trump became president, his sons stopped doing international business. When Joe Biden became vice president, his family started doing international business deals.

PAVLICH: Exactly.

WATTERS: When he goes over there, Joe Biden, and he starts pushing new natural gas deals over in Ukraine, like a month later his son gets this cushy gig where he's bringing home millions of dollars. And then once he gets investigated, Joe Biden uses taxpayer money to threaten them to fire the prosecutor. Or when he flies them over on Air Force 2 to Beijing, and he brings home 1.5 billion with a B, from the Chinese state national bank and no one asks any questions?

All the president is doing is say, hey, maybe there's some corruption out there that we need to look into if we're going to give you guys an additional $400 million to defend yourselves against the Russians, which by the way, Obama and Biden didn't give any money. They gave meals and no money.

WILLIAMS: Jesse, you are struggling so hard to get away with the news of the day.

WATTERS: I feel pretty good, man.

WILLIAMS: You're like gushing.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: This problem is that we have this phone call, we have this -- it's not a transcript. It's a memo, the best, apparently. But here's the thing.

WATTERS: What?

WILLIAMS: The president put it out thinking, well, I'm going to let him have it. I don't think it's that bad. He came out today, it's made it worse for the president because people are saying --

WATTERS: According to who, Juan?

WILLIAMS: You're trying to look into Hillary Clinton? You're looking into Joe Biden? We thought you were the president. How about --

GUTFELD: Yeah, only Trump can be investigated.

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: What about our national investigate Trump in the campaign.

WILLIAMS: Yes. You're saying wiretap Trump Tower, get out of here.

WATTERS: What countries did the Obama administration used to help investigate the Trump campaign? I have the British. I have the Italians. I have the Australians and I have the Ukrainians.

WILLIAMS: Go after--

WATTERS: Yet Donald Trump has been asking allies, hey, can you look into some corruption when there is actual evidence.

PAVLICH: Can I ask Juan a question?

WILLIAMS: Sure.

PAVLICH: So, when the Ukrainian President comes out today in front of the press and makes a joke about how he's happy, they're on television and not on a phone call and then says that there was no pressure. Is he lying?

WILLIAMS: I don't think he's lying. I think he is a man who gets support from the United States government.

PAVLICH: OK, so what's the story of that, what's the problem.

WILLIAMS: And feels that he is compelled to keep the United States as an ally.

PAVLICH: If you don't think that--

WILLIAMS: And the read out, Katie, the read out from that Trump phone call. Here's what Kiev wrote; Kiev wrote that the President made it clear that we have to proceed on this investigation in order to have a good relationship with the United States.

PAVLICH: That's not what it says.

WILLIAMS: That's what Kiev said. That's what Kiev said in their read out on their phone call.

PERINO: All right, guys. Guess what. We're going to take a quick break. Actually, not a break at all. There is no commercial, but a break from this to Greg. He's got a monologue for you.

GUTFELD: Yes. Thank you. You're going to love this. So, right now, the media's face is pressed up against the window of the candy store and they're salivating. The glass fogged hoping against hope staring into a field of dreams, believing if they build an impeachment, a crime will surely come.

So, let's step back and see this for what it is. Another example of the media and the Dems fashioning the worst of things out of the best of times, all to avenge an emotional loss. You want some examples. Well, as America leads the way in climate with cleaner energy, the Left tells their kids, we have a decade to live.

As race relations improved from the mass demonstrations of five years ago. The media sees racism in every nook. As men and women reach equality in all facets, the media questions whether gender is just a fantasy. And as women and minorities gain more employment than ever, the guy running the show is called a bigoted sexist. A guy called Trump, a guy who wakes up every morning in that candy store called America wondering what we can get out of the world and not the reverse.

For him, it's not about money, influence or sex, God knows he's had enough of that for five lifetimes. It's about the job and you're his boss. So, he's a guy who is stingy with both blood and treasure, which is why he's trying to replace real wars with trade wars. He's sending in accountants, instead of tanks. And yet even as America is governed by an orange Gandhi, the median Dems see him as Hitler.

You see the trend, as the world gets better, which the metrics show. The media panics. How can they report good times, if Trump's involved in all of them? So, every day is doomsday since 2016 which is why now they're outside that candy store waiting for that sweet impeachment. Desperate for the taste of revenge, the sweetest bonbon of all. Hold your plot. Dana, while Donald Trump was talking apparently like the other networks were cutting in and out to fact check him. Isn't that nice? Would they ever do that to Obama you think?

PERINO: No.

GUTFELD: How dare they.

PERINO: I don't think so. But hopefully we wouldn't either.

GUTFELD: Yes.

PERINO: Right. That would be the thing. If you want to take the President's speech, take it.

GUTFELD: Yes.

PERINO: But look everybody to each their own. Everyone get your coverage and then we'll get you our viewers. I do think when it comes to the media for example, earlier there was a story that broke around 4 o'clock. The Washington Post said that the Acting Director of National Intelligence was threatening to quit.

GUTFELD: Yes.

PERINO: Because he was not going to be allowed to speak freely and the press secretary at the White House said, The Washington Post gave us literally six minutes to respond. That's her words. I don't know exactly what happened. That's what she said. And I know what it's like, you're at UNGA, you've got six minutes. I've got to call the DNI. You've got to check with the National Security Adviser, you've got to call the CIA.

You can't do all that in six minutes. They went with a story. It goes out there. All of a sudden then you have the Acting Director of National Intelligence say, that's not true.

GUTFELD: Yes.

PERINO: I never threatened to quit. I was never going to quit. He will be on the Hill tomorrow. I do think when it comes to all of this, the breathlessness of the reporting is always good to remind ourselves that waiting for more information is always a better answer.

And I do think that that is true for the Democrats as well. I find it really curious that Nancy Pelosi who had been so cautious and kind of like off-putting to her - the rest of her caucus saying, we're not going to go for impeachment right now. This is bad politics. We don't have anything. There is no smoking gun. We don't have the evidence and yet they do this before they get the transcript.

GUTFELD: Right.

PERINO: It seems to me like they went out on the limb and then sought it off.

GUTFELD: She was like hesitantly - she didn't want to kick that soccer ball into the net. She felt, they're screaming at me. The base is screaming at me. Katie what happens if they actually undo an election? Have they thought it through how half the America might respond, if they try to impeach a President based on a phone call, what would happen?

PAVLICH: Well, Mike Pence will be President and that'll be much worse.

GUTFELD: That's right.

PAVLICH: It'll be much, much worse. So, maybe they should think about this twice.

GUTFELD: Yes.

PAVLICH: You know it's amazing how they continue to talk about the need to protect democracy and the voting and all this stuff but yet they are now going down this road of reversing an election that they don't like and they've done this through a number of steps, through the Russia investigation. This phone call now that we haven't been able to name any kind of high crime and misdemeanor that any of them can cite properly with any kind of evidence.

And the question is, Is the media ever going to learn anything. I mean are the activists or are they reporters. Because a lot of the stuff, in the Mueller Report was supposed to show everything that happened. Robert Mueller was supposed to breathe life into the report. None of that happened. And here we are now with the transcript which doesn't show the quid pro quo, which was reported yesterday multiple times, it doesn't mention Joe Biden nearly as many times as reported and yet there is no correction from quite frankly anybody about the fact that they got this wrong. And I wonder if they sit around in newsrooms and never have a conversation about how they can do things better, because there is a lot.

GUTFELD: You know Jesse, this is like another textbook example of the accelerating mob, we saw with Covington, you saw with Kavanaugh. All this is going to do is Red Pill another 3 million or 4 million Americans.

WATTERS: Yes, I don't trust the media anymore after they screwed up royally on the Russia hoax and they did it again with Kavanaugh and now they've done it again with this story. They got way out in front over their skis and it looks like it was a big nothing burger. Am I allowed to say nothing burger?

GUTFELD: I don't like nothing burger. Nothing burritos.

WATTERS: Nothing burrito fits fine. I want to go back to something that Juan said, he said it is a crime. What is the crime exactly, Juan?

WILLIAMS: I think that he was asking a foreign government to interfere an American politician.

WATTERS: OK. So is that--

GUTFELD: He didn't ask to interfere.

WATTERS: If that was in the statutory crime, number one. Number two, isn't that exactly what the Obama administration did.

WILLIAMS: No, we've been over this.

WATTERS: Use their allies to help spy on Trump campaign.

WILLIAMS: Never.

WATTERS: He never what.

WILLIAMS: Never asked an ally--

WATTERS: OK, so the British were involved in spying.

WILLIAMS: Excuse me.

WATTERS: The Italians were involved, and Australians.

WILLIAMS: Excuse me, the United States intelligence community in the process of gathering information said, we had conversations with people in Britain overseas.

WATTERS: OK.

WILLIAMS: That's not the Obama administration.

WATTERS: OK, so the Obama FBI, DOJ, and CIA aren't the Obama's administration. Juan, go back to school. All right. Also, how is this, they say this is not even a campaign violation. That's the level of the crime. It's not even a campaign violation, because there is nothing a thing of value attached to it. OK. There is no - OK. Hillary Clinton, the 9 million, she sent overseas to get Russian dirt on Trump that they used to spy on him. That's not a thing of value. But this is.

PAVLICH: I think Democrats have to be--

WATTERS: Biden is not even the nominee, and this is his son, the non- Democrat nominee's son getting looked into is a thing of value.

PERINO: Well, and apparently the Obama team at the time during the presidency was uncomfortable with the judgment that Hunter Biden was exercising.

WATTERS: Good for them.

PERINO: But didn't do anything about it. Right. That we know of. Maybe they staved off other things.

WATTERS: How do you think they would allow Hunter Biden to freelance in Ukraine while his dad's running point?

PERINO: Well, that's what I am saying.

WATTERS: And it enriches like how would they ever allow that.

PERINO: And the China--

GUTFELD: They must have been on crack.

WATTERS: This was supposed to be ethical organization.

PERINO: And the China example could be worse. And that story was going to come out. So, both of these things that Nancy Pelosi was hoping we're not going to come to fruition or at least not right away. Impeachment and the Hunter Biden and the questions into the Biden whole extravaganza. You know the trip to China on Air Force Two.

PAVLICH: Right.

PERINO: Those were two things that she was trying to stave off. Now they are front and center. And one thing about the election, we're in the middle of a Democratic primary. Lots of Democrats running for office. We still have 20. Biden has been able to defy gravity and all these polls for a long time with one key issue, electability.

GUTFELD: Yes.

PERINO: So, now his polling numbers have started to come down. Elizabeth Warren have been on the rise, but there is still a lot of time, there could be changes. If you are a Democrat today and the only thing you want is to beat President Trump in 2020 and your key issue is electability. Does any of this make you feel like Joe Biden could be more vulnerable in 2020. And I think the answer is yes and you'll see some of these Democrats step on the gas.

WILLIAMS: I don't think so. And let me just say why I don't think so. First of all, what you got is I mean you were suggesting earlier you know Nancy Pelosi is out on a limb, it's been sawed off. In fact, more people after the release of today's memo are saying you know what, we're behind impeachment.

And I think you're going to see this--

GUTFELD: They have no choice.

WILLIAMS: Kind of shift in the polls as well. And when it comes--

GUTFELD: No, you won't, not in the polls.

WILLIAMS: To this whole business about Joe Biden, this has so been investigated, so much--

PERINO: Hunter Biden.

WILLIAMS: Hunter Biden.

WATTERS: Who investigated, Juan.

WILLIAMS: Well, Peter Schweitzer is the one who started this with his book back in 2018 and then you see a lot of this echo.

GUTFELD: John King.

WILLIAMS: In the conservative chamber. And you know what--

GUTFELD: John King is conservative.

WILLIAMS: These people have searched through this and it has--

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: This is all you had. Let me just say--

WATTERS: Juan, if Don Jr. made a billion from China--

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: The thing about this is you say, oh, it's the media, is the media not supposed to report when the President of the United States engages--

GUTFELD: They are controlling this--

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: They're not supposed to say, it's the media's fault--

GUTFELD: They're not reporting, they're controlling and manipulating.

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: They have to show both sides. Let's show both sides.

GUTFELD: I think we have a great montage. I think we're going to compare two different kind of examples of the media. There was this Russian versus now. I think that's what we're doing. Why not? Maybe.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ADAM SCHIFF, D-CALIF.: I certainly say with confidence that there is significant evidence of collusion.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a crime. It's on the statute books and crimes are typically impeachable offense.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The beginning of the end of the Trump presidency.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is about a commander in chief who actually is meddling with America's national security.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What we're seeing is worse than Watergate.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I keep getting asked, are there echoes of Watergate in this and there are--

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUTFELD: Katie, to quote CNN, same playbook different day. That's how they talk about Trump. They were talking about themselves.

PAVLICH: And if you look at the credibility of who is making these arguments people are going to say, OK, President Trump has been right about this. And people like Adam Schiff and people in the media have been wrong. They've never produced the evidence that they've promised. And I got to say Democrats better be careful what they wish for, because every time they call for one of these investigations, people start looking around about what's going on.

And it always comes back to prove that they've been accusing President Trump and Republicans of exactly what they've been doing. And so, there are serious questions about whether again Joe Biden was selling influence through his son Hunter Biden and whether these deals were being made as a result of his dad.

PERINO: I haven't heard that part. Where is that coming from. I definitely hear that Hunter Biden questionable judgment thing. But the Joe Biden benefited financially.

PAVLICH: No, I'm saying Hunter Biden benefited financially from his father of him being Vice President.

PERINO: Because they said we want to get close to your dad.

PAVLICH: Getting influence essentially.

WILLIAMS: You know what amazes me. Imagine if because you guys keep bringing up Obama. Imagine if the Obama asked a foreign leader to say, can my lawyer Rudy Giuliani or can my Attorney General Bill Barr get involved with more investigation.

WATTERS: Juan.

WILLIAMS: Remember. No, Jesse, remember this, he's President of the United States. If he thinks someone has committed a crime, he can go to the Justice Department and say, we need to investigate. He won't go overseas and say, you get involved in our politics.

WATTERS: What do you think the Russia investigation was, it's a counterintelligence investigation under the auspices of the commander in chief. He set that up. They did it for the President himself.

WILLIAMS: They did it for Obama.

WATTERS: It was a counterintelligence investigation. It was brought through the FBI, the DOJ and the CIA for Barack Obama. It's not criminal.

WILLIAMS: So, in other words, Obama is the one who lives--

WATTERS: Here's the difference. Here's another giving--

WILLIAMS: Had some interference in the election to benefit Donald Trump. That was Barack Obama.

WATTERS: They just spied on him--

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: And then illegally investigated.

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: Let me just tell you another thing. You're saying this isn't investigated fully and no one ever found anything.

WILLIAMS: Nobody.

WATTERS: He's diplomat goes to the Trump Tower Hotel, orders a cocktail and liberals fire up five lawsuits and they want to like to investigate and impeach over the (inaudible) clause. But Joe Biden son takes a billion from the Chinese and you think it's not been investigated fully. It hasn't.

If Don Jr. did that, you think that was OK.

WILLIAMS: So, Jim Comey who is a Republican, Robert Mueller is Republican. All these guys investigate, it's terrible. It's deep state. That's all you've got.

GUTFELD: I love you, Republicans Juan.

WATTERS: Because all I need Juan--

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: Hypocrites.

WILLIAMS: Because what happened today with this, we now know no sawing off of a branch. We now know that this President tried to get a foreign power involved in America's politics.

WATTERS: That's what the Obama administration just did two years ago.

GUTFELD: You know what's great, everybody in America is going to read the transcript and then everybody is going to go, what a bunch of garbage. The media lied to us again.

WATTERS: Right. All right. Nancy Pelosi and others have spent days telling President Trump violated his constitutional oath and broke the law, but then White House released the transcript of the call with Ukraine's President., it turns out though there is no smoking gun or a quid pro quo like Pelosi and her pals promised. Now despite all new information, Democrats are refusing to back away from their talking points.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCHIFF: We have the President of the United States engaged in a shakedown of a foreign president. This is how a mafia boss talks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That is textbook abuse of power and the transcripts have become Exhibit A.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We don't do this in America. It's so gross, it's so corrupt.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If anything is a high crime and misdemeanor, it is what the President did.

REP. NANCY PELOSI, D-CALIF.: He will be held accountable. No one is above the law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATTERS: And then there is this. New polls show only about one third of Americans support impeachment. And not only that Dana, the President's poll numbers are better than they've ever been. Real Clear Politics has 45, highest since his election and higher now than Barack Obama's were at the same time in his presidency.

PERINO: One of the things that was a tipping point for Nancy Pelosi apparently were these seven members of Congress that are Democrats that won in 2018, they are freshmen that all served in the military or have some sort of intel background. And they had been very resistant about impeachment for a long time saying that look, we - and also Trump won their districts in 2016.

That means 2020, those districts are definitely ripe for Republicans to win back. So, they had been saying, no, Nancy Pelosi were not for impeachment. Don't listen to AOC et cetera. Then because of the reporting about this issue before seeing the transcript, before seeing the whistleblower report, those seven got together and wrote this op ed and said, actually now we all believe that we should move forward with an impeachment inquiry and that is when Nancy Pelosi was like, well, what am I going to do now.

Because she in some ways as the Speaker of the House instead of saying we're going to stave this off, she had to be for what's going to happen in her caucus. I don't know if it's showing up in the polls, but in that 37 percent, those are people that are really active in calling their members of Congress I heard a few of them today say, you wouldn't believe my phone's ringing off the hook, saying we have to hold President Trump accountable.

But I would bet that there is just about the same maybe 40 percent of people on the right who are saying, don't you dare do this. And then that margin that's left. They don't want to talk about this. There is not an appetite to do this and this will take several months. This is not something like the Trudeau scandal that happened on Friday and it was done by Monday and nobody ever talked about it again.

This is something because now they're all bought in and anything that happens, they're going to try to shoehorn evidence into this so that they can make their case over and over again and this would probably go through the holidays unless somebody puts a stop to it.

WATTERS: And I believe we have some fresh sound from the President on Nancy Pelosi if we can listen to that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: She's not sure why she's been taken over by the radical Left. And she may be less radical Left herself, but she really has lost her way. I spoke to her about guns yesterday, she didn't even know what I was talking about. The whole party is taken over by the Left. And thank you very much. My poll numbers have gone up, but I don't want it to go up for this reason. Nancy Pelosi as far as I'm concerned unfortunately, she's no longer the Speaker of the House.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATTERS: Well, that was from earlier today. But Greg, I mean it shows that he usually butters her up a little bit when he talks publicly about her, that's over with.

GUTFELD: Well, I think I mean I think he realizes that she's lost control and you have to wonder. So, you've got the media and the Democrats are pushing for impeachment knowing 99 percent it's not going to happen with a Republican led Senate. So, why are they doing this? To influence an election. To influence an election.

I don't know about you but using millions and millions of dollars and man hours of our government to influence the election is worse than a casual conversation with a newly elected President in which that guy initiates the conversation about Giuliani and talks about buying planes. It was a typical couple, but somehow that's worse. No this is worse. How was that not a cause.

PERINO: Can I add one other thing about this is, this is the first time that we've actually had a situation where you have an impeachment inquiry happening before an election.

GUTFELD: Yes.

PERINO: For Nixon and for Clinton, that was all after they had already been re-elected and I don't know, did you want to play this Karl Rove from earlier about how it's hurting the Democrats.

WATTERS: I mean I was going to ask Katie quickly just before we play the Rove sort. About the transparency issue with the President. So, now he's come out and released this transcript. He's saying he's going to release more transcript and now he's challenging the Biden family to release some of their financial records and he exposed also some letters and some trips made by Senate Democrats to Ukraine urging the Ukrainians to be complicit in the investigation of their political opponent Donald Trump. What do you think about that plot?

PAVLICH: There's also been calls for the Vice President Joe Biden to release his transcripts of his conversations with Ukrainian and Chinese leaders while he was in the White House to kind of clear the air about there being no corruption and no paying for influence.

But my question is how are Democrats going to play this. So, Nancy Pelosi yesterday saying she wants all these committees to come up with more information, more fact finding and bring her a conclusion on impeachment. So, after the Russia investigation ended, they essentially just redid the Russia investigation by calling up the same people who had been subpoenaed by Robert Mueller.

Well, who are they going to call up now, if they're going for a different direction on this investigation, because if they're going to hold hearings, they're going to have to have witnesses, the whistleblower said that they want to come up? Lindsey Graham saying sure we'll have a hearing on it, but what - who are Democrats actually going to talk to when it comes to issuing those subpoenas and getting valid information and fact finding. We have the transcript.

WATTERS: That's a really good point. I hadn't thought of that. I want to ask Juan now. Karl Rove thinks that Joe Biden might suffer some blowback from all of this. Let's listen and you can react to that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARL ROVE, FORMER WHITE HOUSE DEPUTY CHIEF OF STAFF: The Democrats have put themselves in a place. Think about this. This is going to hurt Joe Biden badly because we're going to be talking about Ukraine and the idea of Hunter Biden being hired by a Moscow leaning oligarch in order to demonstrate that he had juice with the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATTERS: And going back to the point before if Liz Warren, her primary I think thing for running for President one of them at least is corruption and rooting out corruption in the Trump administration. Now you have a big corruption cloud floating over.

WILLIAMS: You do not.

WATTERS: You don't?

WILLIAMS: No, in fact this is--

WATTERS: You don't.

WILLIAMS: Let me just say--

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: The big cloud here today is what about isn't - and an attempt to try to drag Joe Biden or Hunter Biden or somebody just get somebody's body in here--

GUTFELD: That's called comparison.

WILLIAMS: So, we can distract you from what's going on with the news and President Trump.

GUTFELD: We just saw the transcript.

WILLIAMS: By the way let me just tell you something. The House can impeach the President. It's the Senate that would have to convict. And so, he can be impeached. And I think the President did not want this. I don't think he wanted an impeachment proceeding.

WATTERS: I don't think he wanted either.

WILLIAMS: And I think that he made a tremendous mistake today by releasing this memo because everybody said--

WATTERS: You're against transparency.

PAVLICH: Oh! My God.

WATTERS: You rather have him hide the memo.

WILLIAMS: No, here's the thing--

PAVLICH: Cover up.

WILLIAMS: What happened in the Mueller case and in other case I think this goes back to something Dana was talking about earlier.

WATTERS: You wanted the President to cover this up?

WILLIAMS: Let me just finish - can I finish a thought. It goes back to something Dana was talking about earlier. She said suggested, Nancy Pelosi should have waited. Should have been this, when you have the moderates. This is not the Left-wing of the Democratic Party. These are moderates, people who have been--

GUTFELD: Of the Left wing.

WILLIAMS: In the intelligence community, people have been in the military who were reluctant. Oftentimes people who come from districts that President Trump carried in 2016 who finally said, this is too much. The second point to be made here is those folks then said, you know what, this memo whatever that we saw today is perfect evidence as you heard, and we played some of these sound bites of corruption of the United States Constitution by the--

PERINO: Can I mention something about the timing of it.

WATTERS: Yes.

PERINO: OK. You have the - the news comes out that this is all happening. We know that there could be a possibility of releasing a transcript. I was against that because I think the confidentiality makes a lot of sense, but the President made a decision, he releases it and it's out there and it is what it is.

So, you have these seven members release this op ed on Monday and they get that to Nancy Pelosi. In the afternoon, she finds out from the White House that they are going to release the transcript and then she scheduled the 4 o'clock meeting and then she did the 5 o'clock statement. I'm just saying from the timing perspective, could Nancy Pelosi the most powerful woman in government not have said, thanks guys. The seven of you, I hear you. They say they're going to release the transcript. Let's see what it says. And then you wouldn't already be on the road to impeachment.

WILLIAMS: And so, what I was saying to you is what happened with Mueller.

PAVLICH: Nothing.

WILLIAMS: Bill Barr comes out and says, no obstruction, no collusion. Doesn't he steer the whole narrative and conversation in the country as a spin effort to protect Donald Trump.

WATTERS: But there wasn't any collusion.

WILLIAMS: And so when we find out - yes, there is evidence, they decided not to indict on the basis of the evidence or the context between the Russians or they left open obstruction to the Justice Department because of a policy memo that says, you can't indict a sitting President.

PAVLICH: Mueller testified, that's not true.

WILLIAMS: That's different. And that's why in speaking to Dana here, that's why I think Nancy Pelosi said, Bill Barr and the Justice Department now say, you don't have to release this, don't go forward. We have questions about what the DNI—

PERINO: I just think that it would have been prudent to wait 12 hours.

WILLIAMS: I just think people felt--

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: Usually you investigate for evidence and then you charge and sort of charge than look for evidence afterwards.

PAVLICH: No, but to Dana's point. She not only did that and jumped ahead of it, knowing the transcript would be released and why would you release a transcript if it has really damning information in it.

WILLIAMS: But it did.

PAVLICH: And then an hour after it had been released publicly. Nancy Pelosi is still saying on Capitol Hill that she hasn't seen it. She doesn't know what's in it, but it has very bad information.

PERINO: Right.

PAVLICH: And therefore, they're moving forward with it.

WATTERS: And they said it was about a quid pro quo and now it turns out - it doesn't even matter if it's quid pro quo.

PAVLICH: And they're moving the goal post.

WATTERS: They want to impeach on quid.

PAVLICH: Right.

WATTERS: And also, in this so-called hearing that they're going to use to investigate the President and impeach him, maybe they could use this comment from the Ukrainian President as Exhibit A. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT: You write that nobody pushed me. Yes.

TRUMP: And there was no pressure. Because you know what, there was no pressure. And by the way, you know there was no pressure. All you have to do is see it what went on the call. But you know that whatever he can do in terms of corruption because the corruption is massive.

Now when Biden's son walks away with millions of dollars from Ukraine and he knows nothing and they're paying him millions of dollars, that's corruption.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATTERS: I mean I think that might be played in the impeachment hearing, Greg.

GUTFELD: I kind of like that guy by the way, he seems like a real funny person. You know none of this matter because this is all kabuki theater performed by the Democrats and the media which requires total amnesia of every single previous time their hair caught on fire.

Right. And we know, there was no phone call. There was no casual phone call. It would have been another act of phantom racism or perhaps the tax returns would come back up. Remember the tax returns were a big deal last week.

WATTERS: Yes.

GUTFELD: What about sharpie gate. Remember that. Remember what the things he said about the center back. Everything is like this giant thing and it doesn't work. It reminds me that it reminds me when I drink tequila, it always makes me sick. But then time passes and then I drink tequila again. I drink tequila again and I get sick. That's the meeting the Democrats, they keep running into the same wall. PERINO: You know what? I'm at a point today where I would actually drink tequila.

GUTFELD: I had some in my office.

PERINO: I haven't had it in like maybe like many years.

GUTFELD: I have some in my office and it's cheap so it's going to get you really sick. So, we haven't had a time to talk about my new wardrobe change.

WATTERS: Yes.

GUTFELD: This is going to be my new look.

WATTERS: Very, very good. I like it, it's just black. No coat, no tie.

GUTFELD: Exactly.

WATTERS: It's the new Greg.

GUTFELD: It's the new Greg.

WATTERS: I really appreciate.

PAVLICH: It's a good fall fashion move.

GUTFELD: Yes, exactly. Thank you for allowing me the time to share that.

WATTERS: OK. Now we're also learning a little bit about the lawyer Katie, who is representing this whistleblower. He is a Schumer guy. He's a Hillary guy and he runs a group that pays whistleblowers, which is pretty unethical, a lot of lawyers believe. And you know I don't know where this guy came from, but he also has some connections.

PAVLICH: That's what I am talking about.

WATTERS: He was labeled as a partisan by the--

PAVLICH: Right. That's what I'm talking about. Like do Democrats really want to dig in on this.

WATTERS: Is he going to be the guy to testify.

PAVLICH: Well look the person who I think well maybe, they're going to have to ask somebody to testify about this if they want to move forward--

PERINO: Certainly, be Rudy Giuliani right. So, like he's been out there, he's saying, I've got all the evidence on my phone. He's out there.

(CROSSTALK)

PERINO: State Department told me to do it. And everyone - yes, and so that will definitely, it will happen. And you know what, I feel like they just relish the fight. And I know even today you mentioned the tax returns. I think that the President's lawyers are actually in court today in New York trying to stave that off. They have so many different lawsuits that are up against them from Democratic politicians, elected leaders, across the country.

It's irrational to think that they shouldn't be able to fight back. And if fighting back is in terms of politics and I'm just raising questions. What about this? What about that? I mean to me politics is a contact sport and we've certainly learned that.

WILLIAMS: Yes. But I think a lot of that is speculation. So, let's just go with it--

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: In other words, I hear people say, what about Joe Biden's tax return. We've never seen Trump's tax returns. That's what we know. And here's what else we know. We know about this phone call. And we know--

GUTFELD: That it's nothing.

WILLIAMS: Constitution of the United States that says you can't do that.

WATTERS: What article is that.

WILLIAMS: It says, you are to protect--

GUTFELD: You can't call.

WILLIAMS: And defend and preserve the Constitution of the United States.

WATTERS: OK.

WILLIAMS: You do not get involved in getting foreign governments to interfere. And the idea that he did this--

WATTERS: That's exactly what Obama did. Number two, Juan--

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: What about this guy? What about that guy?

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: Something you did.

GUTFELD: What Trump said to him was look at something that already happened. That is not interfering with an election. Jesus.

WILLIAMS: So, here's a timeline for you--

PERINO: And we spent two years investigating--

WILLIAMS: President Trump and his administration, he directs his administration not to advance military aid to our ally in the Ukraine and then switches doors. Oh, it's about corruption. It's really--

WATTERS: It was Obama and Biden that would hold military aid--

WILLIAMS: This is so crass--

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: Military that was just a bunch--

WILLIAMS: Jesse, in other words, he delays the payment and then he makes this phone call. And you guys say, is that illegal?

WATTERS: Juan, let me ask you something.

PAVLICH: Can I actually say something about that real quickly.

WATTERS: Go ahead.

PAVLICH: Some of the news that's been lost in all of the transcript issue is that the Justice Department announced today that John Durham is also investigating Ukrainian influence in the 2016 election.

WATTERS: Yes, because there's a lot of that.

PAVLICH: And Democrats are getting very nervous about that based on their history of working with Ukraine.

GUTFELD: We should be championing Trump for going after corruption.

WATTERS: I thought we wanted to push the Russians back and root out corruption and make sure people don't interfere in elections. Juan. I guess that's all Trump was doing. He's just being slapped around for it.

PERINO: The Russians never should have interfered in the first place and then the Ukraine. All right. I think I'm taking this out. Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of “The Five.” Special Report is up next.

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