This is a rush transcript from "The Story," July 17, 2020. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
JON SCOTT, FOX NEWS HOST: Thank you Bret and Happy Friday. I'm John Scott in for Martha MacCallum tonight and this is The Story. As the country grapples with Covid-19, a partisan divide is breaking out when it comes to the issue of masks. Here's President Trump in an exclusive interview with our very own Chris Wallace airing on Fox News Sunday, this weekend.
A new poll shows that when you break it down by party affiliation, only 38 percent of Republicans and those who lean Republicans say they always wear a mask when near others outside your home, compared to 70 percent of Democrats and their leaning voters. And beyond the public sentiment, bitter legal battles over mask enforcement are erupting within states.
George's Republican Governor Brian Kemp is suing the Democrat Mayor of Atlanta Keisha Lance Bottoms in an attempt to block the city's mandatory mask rule. A move bottoms has decried as bizarre. Here's the governor today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. BRIAN KEMP (R-GA): Instead of issuing mandates that are confusing and unenforceable, I'm asking all local leaders to enforce the current executive order, enforce the rules that we have put in place to keep employees and customers safe at local businesses, enforce the provisions that ensure folks are staying six feet apart at large gathering, enforce measures to protect the medically fragile.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT: In Louisiana, the Republican state Attorney General is slamming Democrat Governor John Bel Edwards for an executive order that mandates masks and imposes other restrictions who like Kemp says it is legally, unenforceable. Louisiana's Attorney General Jeff Landry joins me in moments.
But first to White House correspondent Kevin Corke with the Back Story. Kevin.
KEVIN CORKE, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Evening John. The questions I think are fairly straightforward. Can a state or city chief executive at a whim, shut down parts or whole economies under their charge because of what they deem an emergency? By the way the other questions would be like who gets to define that emergency and what of the role of the legislature of the federal government?
That is at the crux of the debate playing out in a number of states across America. You mentioned Georgia where the governor there is suing the Mayor of Atlanta over anti-Covid-19 mandates and now that debate is also playing out in Louisiana where the state's governor is mandating masks.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. JOHN BEL EDWARDS (D-LA): Masks are now mandated statewide for everyone aged eight and older. At the end of the day, while I know that this is going to be unpopular with some and controversial with some, we know that face masks work. It really is that simple.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORKE: But that position laid out Saturday has since drawn the attention of the state's Attorney General, who said in a statement, "It is my opinion as to the chief legal officer of the State that the order does not pass the constitutional test. The mask mandate, the 50-person indoor/outdoor gathering limit and the bar closure are likely unconstitutional and" this is important "unenforceable."
And so the separation of powers debate really as I think as much as any part of this debate is obviously individual rights as well and freedoms and the AG says as much in his comments about which the Governor replied this way.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BEL EDWARDS: The order that I issued on Monday is in effect. It is binding, it's mandatory.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORKE: Binding, it is mandatory, says the Governor. Now it's also important point this out the pretty spicy letter from John Bel Edwards to the AG, obviously his forceful dissent. The Governor said this reminded him of that famous line "everyone is entitled to their own opinion but not their own facts." Obviously further suggesting that in abundance of caution coupled with an aggressive anti-Covid-19 strategy as supported by the White House coronavirus task force and data.
He's been pointing to science all along the way but John, lastly, I can say this, Landry and others still point to competing science including some that note that over 98 percent of those who get the virus could recover.
And so the question remains, why crater the economy and the wellbeing of families and children, when mitigation can be achieved with the resumption of some sense of normalcy?
That is really a debate that we're all going to watch play out, perhaps in the courts moving forward, John.
SCOTT: All right, Kevin Corke in Washington. Kevin, thank you.
CORKE: You bet.
SCOTT: Louisiana's Attorney General Jeff Landry joins me now. General Landry, you announced on Tuesday that you had tested positive for Covid-19. A lot of people might be surprised that you're sitting for this interview right now. How are you feeling?
ATTORNEY GENERAL JEFF LANDRY (R-LA): I feel great. Really have had no symptoms. Got tested on Sunday and another test on Monday. Both confirm that I had it and just been quarantined you know, staying isolated and taking my vitamins and meds per my doctor's orders and just going to try to get you know, through to next 10 to 14 days, get a couple of tests and hopefully get back to work in the office.
SCOTT: Does your own case though illustrate perhaps the utility of masks? You're not feeling symptoms, you're feeling fine but you don't want to go out and - and spread it to any other people. That's what a lot of the scientific experts say justifies the wearing of masks in public because people who might not know they're carrying the virus can spread it.
LANDRY: Well, here's - here's what's very important. It's not that I'm anti-masks. It's just that the constitution doesn't allow you to mandate in a very arbitrary capricious and - and really broad sense in a way that the Governor issued his executive orders.
By the Governor's own words in the very press statement that where he announced the mask mandate, he said several times in questions by - when questioned by reporters that he was not interested in enforcing his order and then in some cases, he was not even going to enforce it as to churches.
And again, I think you know the Governor is a lawyer. He knows that the order is extremely broad and it's unconstitutional. I can appreciate it being aspirational. It's just that we can't mandate this type of conduct. Business owners certainly have the right to demand or set forth a policy that where they ask their patrons to wear masks, there's nothing wrong with that.
It's just that the government can't sweep with such a broad brush. But again, if the emergency is you know, based upon what numbers? Where is our benchmark?
SCOTT: Well, the benchmark in Louisiana right now seems to be, I'm talking about the number of cases, seems to be problematic. Louisiana reporting more than 2000 additional cases for the last four days. 88,590 total and 3,000 - nearly 3,400 deaths since this all began. The Governor is quoted as saying you know or recently said that he wished you would listen to your own words from March 18.
We dug up that sound that he was talking about from you and - and wanted to play it here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LANDRY: Some have asked me if the government has the authority to take certain actions, like limiting the size of public gatherings, suspending legal deadlines and ordering restaurants and bars to limit their service. The short answer is yes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT: So what has changed General, since you made those remarks?
LANDRY: Well, a lot has changed. Those remarks were back in March when we were dealing with a novel virus that we knew really nothing about. We didn't know the infection rate, its mortality rate. We didn't know how to treat it. We were told at that time - at that time when I was making those comments that 2 million to 2 million people were going to die, here in this country from the virus.
Today we - it's patently different, right? We know that thankfully those experts were wrong. We have a much better grip on infection rate. We have a much better grip on the transmission rate. Our medical providers are doing a fantastic job in treating it. The length of hospital stays has decreased. The number of deaths has fallen dramatically and so again the facts change and so again, you have to remember, these governors, all of these governors are operating under emergency orders.
If the emergency changes, if the threat changes, then their level of mandating has to change as well. That's just constitutional, right? And in fact in Louisiana, it's not only constitutional at the state and federal level but it's also at the statutory level as well. When facts change, these things have to change as well.
SCOTT: Attorney General Jeff Landry from state of Louisiana. General Landry, we hope you continue to recover. We wish you well. Thanks very much.
LANDRY: Thank you. Thank you.
SCOTT: Also with us tonight, Dr Marty Makary, Professor of Health Policy and Management at Johns Hopkins University School of Public Health and a Fox news medical contributor. The mask controversy goes on Dr. Makary. There are those who say masks do no good and others who say you got to have masks, if you're going to be outside. What's the science?
DR. MARTY MAKARY, FOX NEWS MEDICAL CONTRIBUTOR: Well, good evening John. You know, I think it's good for our public leaders to show some degree of humility around a virus that's highly contagious, very deadly in vulnerable populations and one we have not yet fully understood.
As the data comes in, it's very clear both scientifically and empirically, looking at the geographic distribution of universal masking policies around the world, that countries that adopt it are able to manage the infection even after out of control outbreaks. It's high benefit, it's low cost and it's compatible with an open economy because we've got a very difficult choice to make.
Are we going to go back to shut downs which are harsh or are we going to adopt universal masking and this kind of political in-fighting that's often along the lines of personality disputes, it's not healthy at a time when we need a unified message, just as the medical community has a unified message on this.
SCOTT: Yes, in the meantime we've been talking about the fact that Georgia's Governor is suing the Mayor of Atlanta over her mask mandate. He says you ought to have one rule for the entire state and he doesn't think that her rule for the citizens of Atlanta or residents of Atlanta is proper. How our people to make some sense of all this?
MAKARY: Well, I think ultimately some of these political leaders are going to lose some credibility. Health care providers are going to push back, local hospital administrators, doctors, nurses who work in an ICU are going to get the word out. People are going to know somebody who is hospitalized. You know right now, today in Florida John, there's 9000 people in the hospital having trouble breathing are there because they're on the brink of an ICU admission.
If for people who don't take this seriously, I would say those 9000 people in Florida hospitals would disagree and we have same policies with seat belts, it's time - it's time to have the same with masking for a short period of time until this is beyond us.
SCOTT: Well, in a short period of time you know, people are going to look back and say, it seems like coronavirus has been with us forever. People been out of work, locked you know, locked into their homes, you know home confinement in a sense. You've got kids out of school for you know, the last school year and probably, possibly out of school for the next year. When does it end?
MAKARY: Well, all of the news on vaccines is promising and if you couple that with the amount of community immunity which is now at 30 percent in New York and some parts of Massachusetts, you're pretty close to herd immunity with only 20 percent more of the population getting immunized. That's really promising remember.
Also we got to be selective. Kids are very low risk of getting serious health complications. There's only 14 deaths among children albeit tragic from Covid-19. That's less than pneumonia, that's less than flu in the same age group. What we need to do is identify those vulnerable at schools and have a selective strategy rather than these harsh strategies that have their own health consequences.
SCOTT: We will get into that school debate next. Dr. Marty Makary, thank you.
MAKARY: Thank you, John.
SCOTT: A highly respected group of academics and medical professionals out with a new report, recommending students should return to in-person learning this fall saying "without in-person instruction, schools risk children falling behind academically and exacerbating educational inequities."
Victor Davis Hanson, when The Story continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BETSY DEVOS, SECRETARY OF EDUCATION: The reality is the science tells us that in - being in school is safe for children. The science says it is safe for kids to be in school. We clearly have to follow guidelines around hygiene, wearing masks when appropriate and ensuring that teachers have distance and protection but there - this can be done.
It's a matter of will and it's a convenient argument to make now when - when you - when we don't - you say follow the science. Well, let - let's follow the science indeed and let's ensure that kids can get back into school and that parents and families that need to have their kids five days a week, have that option.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT: That's Education Secretary Betsy DeVos making the case for students to return to classrooms this fall amid a raging debate over whether it's safe to do so. Tonight, a new report from the highly regarded National Academies of Science, Engineering and Medicine stressing that whenever possible, younger children should go back.
A quote, "Schools should prioritize reopening for grades K-5 and for students with special needs who would be best served by in-person instruction." Here now Victor Davis Hanson, senior fellow at Stanford University's Hoover Institution and author of 'The Case for Trump.' You are an advocate of getting children back to school, correct, why?
VICTOR DAVIS HANSON, SENIOR FELLOW, HOOVER INSTITUTION: Yes, for a lot of reason because we have to revere the science. The science says that children rarely get it and they're not super spreaders. They don't - they don't spread it. They're almost like cooling rods in a Covid-19 reaction. They tamper down the disease.
And more importantly, psychologists and sociologists have told us again and again and again that it's very harmful for childhood development to be locked at home and be deprived of the cultural and intellectual stimulus of education.
And more importantly, we're - we're reaching $30 trillion in aggregate debt and if we're going to protect the vulnerable and the weak, we have to get people out on the work force to restore the economy and they can't do it if they're staying home, taking care of their children so it makes no sense in any scientific dimension.
What I'm really worried about is the anti-science movement because we've had two catastrophic decisions during this epidemic that were anti-science. The first was in four or five states, people who were sick were turned away from the hospital and put into rest homes. Just four states strong. Massachusetts, Connecticut, New York and New Jersey, about 11 percent of the U.S. population. They account for 50 percent of the dead people.
It was an absolutely unscientific decision and the second one was even more catastrophic. We had a downward curve on this quarantine. People have put up with it. They were getting accustomed to it and then between May 26 and the present day, we have millions of people flooding our major dense cities without masks, without social distancing, without sanitizing themselves on their hands and not only was that dangerous and anti-scientific but it destroyed the credibility of the quarantine.
So it's logical that people are hit and miss now because they say to themselves well, all the experts said that we were supposed to quarantine and we did and then they turned around and said you know, it's all right to go out and demonstrate or loot and so we have - we've had a lot of science and a lot of anti-science but we got a separate who's the scientific and who's the anti-scientific.
SCOTT: Joe Biden, for his part has been quite critical of President Trump and the Trump administration's efforts to combat the virus. Joe Biden is putting his eggs very much in the online learning basket. Listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If I were President, I'd be sending funding - a funding bill right now to the Congress today. Every single student should be able to access high quality distance learning. We can't allow the pandemic to further exacerbate educational disparities that already exist in this country. We need a White House that's laser focused on closing those gaps.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT: So he wants to spend money to ensure that distance learning is improved. What do you think about that idea?
DAVIS HANSON: We have to translate that, John. Translate it means I reject the scientific consensus of child psychologists, sociologists and education experts who all unanimously want kids to go back to school and I sign - I reject the science that says that children are neither likely to be infected nor to spread the infection.
And then more importantly we've already borrowed $3 trillion this year in addition to about a trillion dollar annual deficit so we're getting that near $4 trillion so when he says he wants to spend all this money and he wants everybody's children to be locked down and that means a lot of the work force will not be able to return to work, he has a moral and political and social and economic requirement, a duty to tell us how he's going to pay for it because it's fantasy. It's - it doesn't make any sense.
You can't tell the entire country to stay home with their children when they're going to get an inadequate education then you're going to borrow more and more money. How's - how does that work out?
SCOTT: Right because then those kids, if the parents are staying home and not going to work, they're not adding to the economic output of the country.
DAVIS HANSON: No, they can't. If I - if I came from Mars and I looked at this dispassionately, I would say if this was not 2020 and Donald Trump was not up for re-election, we wouldn't have these arguments because the science is clear. The science says kids can go back to school without a lot of threat.
They won't spread the virus and people who are in the education profession who are vulnerable can be protected. They can stay home and do things by tele-learning or something. That's the science and the science economically says this economy will not sustain itself and the level of debt unless people get back to work. What Joe Biden is talking about is a political stance. It's not a scientific or rational statement.
SCOTT: Victor Davis Hanson, good to have you on. Thank you.
Meantime the city of Portland in a direct standoff with the Trump administration over the presence of federal officers sent in to enforce the law after more than seven consecutive weeks of protests there. Officials saying the federal government is only making the situation work - worse I should say.
Acting deputy - Deputy Secretary of Homeland Security Ken Cuccinelli responds next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCOTT: The city of Portland, Oregon erupting into its fiftieth consecutive night of protests, last night. Demonstrators outside a federal building dispersed by Homeland security agents using tear gas and flash grenades.
Local and city officials say the presence of federal officers is escalating the violence and that the city would be safer without them. Here's the Mayor, a short time ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR TED WHEELER (D) PORTLAND, OREGON: Last week, we were seeing the de- escalation of the violence. We were seeing things calm down but the intervention of federal officers reignited tensions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT: Acting Deputy Secretary of Homeland Security Ken Cuccinelli joins me now. What do you say to the Mayor and the Governor of Oregon, both of whom are saying federal troops should not be there?
KEN CUCCINELLI, ACTING DEPUTY SECRETARY, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY: Well, of course you mean federal officers. Look, they have utterly failed that the first job of government and that is to maintain public safety and they are looking for someone to blame. Who do they blame? They always want to blame the president.
The reality is we've seen all around the country where you advance responsible policing in the face of violence, the violence receipts. That is true across the country and Mayor Wheeler's comments, he's making up reality there.
He wants to tell you that things were calming down in Portland after 45 straight days of violence and suddenly, the fact that people showed up and actually enforce the law in our area of jurisdiction near the federal courthouse, for instance, somehow ratcheted up the violence.
Well, we have determined that President Trump's leadership to ratchet down the violence, to bring peace not just to Portland but to as many cities as we can. State and local officials have most of the responsibility but, where we can step in and advance the cause of peace in the streets, the president has insisted to us that we should do that.
SCOTT: Mayor Ted Wheeler had this to say in those remarks made a short time ago. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR TED WHEELER (D-OR), PORTLAND: The words and actions from President Trump and the Department of Homeland Security have shown that this is an attack on our democracy. Keep your troops in your own buildings or have them leave our city.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT: An attack -- an attack on our democracy is pretty strong stuff. How do you respond?
CUCCINELLI: Well, there are people attacking our democracy and they are in the streets of Portland with the encouragement of Mayor Wheeler and they get to roam free by and large without consequence. Some of them are getting arrested, small numbers. We are doing our part on the federal side but we don't have jurisdiction over the whole city of course.
It's -- you look back at Mayor Wheeler's history in Portland, he encouraged and allowed attacks on an ICE facility there two years ago. It seems like he regretted that as if it was a mistake after the fact. But here we see him repeating it in the streets of Portland, again, for the last seven weeks where he has encouraged these folks to come out and use the legitimate concerns following the George Floyd murder to mask violence, looting and not protesting.
I mean, let's be really clear, that's not what these people are coming to do. They are coming to attack our democracy at its base. They don't respect elections. They don't respect the law and they want to tear it all down. And Mayor Wheeler is right there with them.
SCOTT: But our DHS officers, are they only guarding federal buildings or have they moved out into the streets, to sort of clear a street? One of the complaints is that they are using tear gas which under Oregon law right now is not to be used against some of these crowds.
CUCCINELLI: So, we have jurisdiction that starts with an organization in the Department of Homeland Security called federal protective service. They are responsible for protecting federal buildings and CBP and ICE and other law enforcement officials from around the Department of Homeland Security are there to support the FPS.
And if you see pictures of the courthouse, you see the graffiti, the violence directed at federal officers. They are there to protect federal property, to protect federal officers as best we can to coordinate with the Portland police bureau to the extent those officers are allowed to cooperate and trying to keep the peace.
That doesn't mean we're confined to federal property per se. We have arrested people for attacks on both the property and law enforcement officials off the property because our jurisdiction allows us to do that. But federal jurisdiction doesn't go everywhere that the local authorities like Mayor Wheeler and like the governor of Oregon are going to have to finally pick up their responsibilities and actually reestablish peace.
We can only do so much of it, that America is a big place in the federal government even though DHS is the largest law enforcement agency in the country. It still only has so many, and so we will do what we can and where we can --
(CROSSTALK)
SCOTT: Just a -- just a few seconds.
CUCCINELLI: -- to reestablish peace as we are doing in Portland.
SCOTT: Just a few seconds left but --
CUCCINELLI: Sure.
SCOTT: Just a few seconds left but how long do you expect your officers to be there?
CUCCINELLI: We expect our officers to be there and arresting violent criminals as long as they are coming out with the intent of committing violence in and around Portland and where we have jurisdiction. However long this goes.
SCOTT: Ken Cuccinelli. Ken Cuccinelli, the acting deputy Homeland Security Secretary. Thanks very much for coming on.
CUCCINELLI: Good to be with you.
SCOTT: The head of the New York State Troopers Union says he wants his officers off the streets of New York City, saying they are being set up for failure and new reforms make it impossible for them to do their jobs. That story, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCOTT: The head of the New York State Troopers Union says he wants his officers out of New York City. Saying his officers' hands are tied in the wake of a recently signed NYPD reform bill that Mayor Bill de Blasio signed.
Quote, "If we continue to allow our members to remain stationed and conduct police activity within the five boroughs of New York City, we may be opening them up to the civil and criminal liability simply by doing the job they were trained to do."
Joining me now, Thomas Mungeer, the president of the New York State Troopers Benevolent Association. I want to read for you, sir, some of the statistics out of New York City over the last week.
On Monday there were 18 shooting victims, 13 on Tuesday, 12 on Wednesday, and 11 on Thursday. Crime is spiking in New York City. Given those circumstances, why would you want to pull state troopers out?
THOMAS MUNGEER, PRESIDENT, NEW YORK STATE TROOPERS BENEVOLENT ASSOCIATION: Well, as the head of their union I have to look out for my member's best interest. And what New York city has done, they basically handcuffed my members into effecting an arrest.
Again, are the chokehold bill that's a statewide law now, I don't have a problem with that. But what New York City has done, you cannot put any pressure whatsoever on somebody's diaphragm. And any tactic even in a high school wrestling match, if my numbers were to employ that, they could now be permanently arrested by arresting a violent person.
SCOTT: Mayor de Blasio is quite proud of the reforms package. Here is what he said as he signs it. He says the black lives matter movement has been at the forefront of change in New York city and across our nations. I'm proud to sign these sweeping reforms into law and honor the work they've done. I'm confident we make these reforms work and continue strengthening the bond between police officers and our communities.
The new rules of band chokeholds. They even ban, as I understand it, they ban you from essentially grabbing somebody by the chest, is that correct?
MUNGEER: Well, you can't even put any pressure on somebody's torso. Apparently, or obviously somebody who wrote this law has never arrested a violent person who doesn't want to be arrested. When you are on the ground wrestling around with somebody it's inevitable that there is going to be a knee or something in somebody's chest, and to bring somebody under control.
And now within 57 counties outside New York City my members are trained to do it in a certain way and they are fine there. But within the five counties in New York City, this is a whole different ball game. We had two different sets of rules within the same state and I would like my members removed from the city. If they -- if that's the reforms that they want to do, then they can do with the New York State police.
SCOTT: Yes. The training that your troopers have received is no longer supported or even allowed by the city of New York.
Thomas Mungeer from the troopers union, thank you.
MUNGEER: Thank you.
SCOTT: A professional athlete who supports the Black Lives Matter movement set off a firestorm for wearing a mask that appears to be a nod to law enforcement and the blue lives matter movement, begging the question, can people support both causes?
Jack Brewer and Rochelle Ritchie, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCOTT: NBA star James Harden who supports the Black Lives Matter movement igniting a virtual firestorm after the Houston Rockets tweeted this image of him wearing a thin blue line mask generally synonymous with support for law enforcement.
The backlash was swift. One user tweeting, yes, I didn't think I could hate Harden more but then he rocks a blue lives matter skull mask. Another writing, that's a blue lives matter mask, burn out and get a different one.
But one making this point. Quote, black lives matter, blue lives matter, all lives matter. Don't judge the whole on a few bad apples. It turns out, Harden wasn't making a statement after all.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAMES HARDEN, NBA PLAYER, HOUSTON ROCKETS: I wasn't trying to make a political statement. Honestly, I wore it just because it covered my whole face, my beard, it's pretty simple. There are people that honestly do their job at a high level and then there's B.S. people in every profession. It was something that just covered my whole beard, I thought it was, you know, it looks cool. That was it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT: With us now Jack Brewer, CEO of the brewer group and former professional football player. Also, Rochelle Ritchie, former press secretary for the House Democrats and spokesperson during the Freddie Gray trials in Baltimore.
Jack, to you first. The Twitter-Audie were quick to jump on Harden. Is there not room to support police as well as black lives?
JACK BREWER, CEO, THE BREWER GROUP INC.: Of course. And no one has the right to even comment on James Harden. He's a stand-up guy, a great character and he can support his law enforcement, he can support black lives. You can support law enforcement officers and to be against bad ones, just like you can support black lives but not be for the anti-Christ organization or black lives matter.
So, you can do things at one time. In this nation, we need -- we really need to be talking about how quick we are to cancel people, to shame them. That's the reason why we see what's going on in our streets. Because we need to be focused on what's getting us into this situation. And that's the fatherless kids that are across our nation right now.
You see the kids right now looking up to these professional athletes like myself and like others, we need to stand up for them. We need to teach them principles again. We need to start teaching these kids to get back to the word of God and getting back foundations into our nation. Our families are broken. That is the cause of the issues. Nothing else.
We need to keep our enterprise and fight the spiritual battle that's wrecking our nation ripping us apart right now and creating divisiveness around this country.
SCOTT: Well, Rochelle, you also want to teach kids that, you know, most police officers are OK, don't you? I mean, when you demonize the police, when a guy puts on a blue lives matter mask and gets demonize for it, that doesn't help anybody, does it?
ROCHELLE RITCHIE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, you do want to teach kids that not all police officers are bad, and you also want to teach police that not all black people are bad. And I think that what James Harden did, I mean, he just made a mistake. He clearly said that it was unintentional.
However, I do think that, you know, when we look at the idea of this mask, it's the fact that it is anti-black lives matter because often times when you hear blue lives matter, similar to when you hear all lives matter, it's the rebuttal to black lives matter and police brutality that's conflicted upon black people. So that's why they are so offended. Should he be cancelled? Absolutely not.
SCOTT: Well, that's the way -- that's the way you might hear it. I mean I think all lives matter.
RITCHIE: OK.
SCOTT: I think murders are terrible thing no matter how it happened.
BREWER: That's absurd.
RITCHIE: That's fine, you can think that just like I can think --
SCOTT: Go ahead.
RITCHIE: -- that it is absurd that, you know, for people to think that blue lives matter and all lives matter is a rebuttal to black lives matter. I'm not saying that people who think that are wrong, it's just a fact that they use it to counter the Black Lives Matter movement and police brutality. That's all I'm saying.
BREWER: And --
RITCHIE: So, I'm not saying that he needs to be canceled --
(CROSSTALK)
SCOTT: Go ahead, Jack.
RITCHIE: -- he can obviously wear the mask if he wants to but it's just the fact of what it represents.
BREWER: Every single person including yourself that feels like supporting police officers is a rebuttal to black lives matter, each one of you will call the police the second something happens in your home --
RITCHIE: Yes.
BREWER: -- or the second you need some help.
RITCHIE: OK.
BREWER: And that is a fact.
RITCHIE: Your point.
BREWER: And so, to say that put that, that messaging is hypocritical and it's putting now the wrong message to our children.
(CROSSTALK)
RITCHIE: First of all, let me -- let me --
BREWER: Our children should be looking up to good --
RITCHIE: -- let me clarify something for you.
BREWER: -- law-abiding police officers, --
RITCHIE: Let me clarify something for you. I work --
(CROSSTALK)
BREWER: -- they should stand up any type of evil --
SCOTT: Let him finish.
RITCHIE: Excuse me.
BREWER: I'll let you finish. They should be standing --
RITCHIE: No, actually you didn't.
BREWER: -- up against any type of evil --
RITCHIE: But go ahead.
BREWER: -- no matter if it's from a police officer or from another individual in our nation. And this divisiveness is what's causing what we see on our streets today.
RITCHIE: I said nothing --
(CROSSTALK)
BREWER: We have black officers, brown officers, and green officers.
RITCHIE: -- absolutely divisive.
BREWER: We need to get back to the point of stop seeing race.
RITCHIE: But nothing divisive.
BREWER: Everything is not racial. Some things are about love and respect.
SCOTT: OK.
BREWER: And we got to get back to loving and respecting our --
(CROSSTALK)
RITCHIE: You're saying about race.
BREWER: The same kids that don't respect police officers --
RITCHIE: I gave you the reason why --
(CROSSTALK)
SCOTT: Rochelle, final thought.
RITCHIE: He's going to keep talking. This is ridiculous.
BREWER: -- don't respect their parents and they don't -- they don't respect --
RITCHIE: This is absolutely ridiculous.
BREWER: -- authority. We need to get off of that.
RITCHIE: This is not about that.
BREWER: It is all about that.
(CROSSTALK)
SCOTT: All right, Rochelle.
RITCHIE: You need to get off of what you're talking about right now. You're trying to be --
(CROSSTALK)
BREWER: That attitude -- that attitude is divisive and evil.
RITCHIE: See, I don't do this. I don't do this. I don't this kind of argumentative kind of thing, that's not my style. I've never been on with you before. All I'm saying is that's why people were upset. I'm not saying why they are upset is correct.
(CROSSTALK)
BREWER: You were on with me last week with all due respect.
RITCHIE: I'm simply saying that -- that's why.
SCOTT: OK.
RITCHIE: OK? I work for the state's attorney's office in Baltimore City along with police officers. I was a crime reporter. I actually turn in -- helped to turn in a suspect that was accused of shooting a police officer.
SCOTT: All right.
RITCHIE: So, I know that there are good police officers --
(CROSSTALK)
SCOTT: We're getting --
BREWER: So then why are you sitting there supporting blue lives matter --
(CROSSTALK)
SCOTT: We're getting -- we are getting away from the -- we are getting away from the area. We are going to have to leave it there.
BREWER: That's crazy. All lives matter, black lives matters.
SCOTT: We are going to have to leave it there.
RITCHIE: I never said that.
BREWER: As a matter of fact, there's a lot of black police officers.
RITCHIE: You're absolutely --
SCOTT: Let me interrupt you both, I'm sorry. We are coming up against a break. We need to leave it there. Thank you both, Jack and Rochelle.
In the meantime, actor Isaiah Washington preview his new Fox Nation show kitchen talk and why he wants to tell the story of real Americans, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCOTT: This week, rapper Kanye West sparking confusion about a possible presidential bid after being on and then off. He qualified to appear on Oklahoma's presidential ballot as an independent. Then he tweeted this picture of himself photoshopped on Mount Rushmore with the caption 2020.
Joining me now, actor Isaiah Washington, the host of Kitchen Talk on Fox Nation. Isaiah, is Kanye running for president?
ISAIAH WASHINGTON, ACTOR: I don't have a comment on that. No, I have never seen a war won. I've never seen an enemy, starting an enemy won over or a culture people move forward without good food. That's my show. That's what Kitchen Talk is about.
SCOTT: Well, we have a little -- we have a little clip of Kitchen Talk. I want to play that for viewers, it's on Fox Nation. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WASHINGTON: Some of the most and fantastic and fascinating conversations I've ever all over the world have happened in the kitchen and at the table. So, come, be a fly on my wall as I cracked the code to what connects us all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT: Makes me hungry. And we have lost our connection, I'm sorry to say to Isaiah Washington. He's back. You're there. So, give us a summation. What's it all about?
WASHINGTON: It is. The whole subject is about talking to real Americans. I have a couple of the structures like some familiar faces. Maybe Kanye -- Kanye West -- Kanye West will come on the show. We can have a real conversation about what he's tweeting and what he's talking about.
I think people with a little vino veritas you have little wine and some great food, people tend to be more calm and less upset about things when they have -- I've never had a food fight or argument over a great dinner. That's -- and that's what I'm offering in this alternative space. The only red meat that we put out on our show, we actually cook it and serve it.
SCOTT: The invitation is out there. Maybe Kanye and maybe Kim will take you up on that, come on the show. It looks great. We'll be watching on Fox Nation in the kitchen. Thanks very much, Isaiah Washington.
And that is The Story of Friday, July 17, 2020. But as always, The Story continues. Have yourself a great weekend. See you back here Monday night at seven. And I'll see you tomorrow on the Fox Report at 6 p.m. Eastern.
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