This is a rush transcript from "Tucker Carlson Tonight," June 12, 2020. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
TUCKER CARLSON, FOX NEWS HOST: Good evening and welcome to TUCKER CARLSON TONIGHT. We're going to have a live update for you in just a moment on the Nation of CHAZ. That's the new breakaway Republic emerging from within downtown Seattle, Washington.
Unfortunately, we've not yet secured visas to visit CHAZ, but we do have pictures of what is happening inside its borders tonight. Stay with us for that.
But first, on Wednesday, Senator Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts proposed an amendment to the Annual Defense Funding Bill. Warren's wording would order The Pentagon to rename all military bases that are currently named for Confederate Civil War generals. Those bases include many of the most famous in the country, Fort Benning in Georgia, Fort Hood in Texas, Fort Bragg in North Carolina.
You may have trained on one of those bases, the men who fought and won World War II did, but Warren's amendment goes farther than just renaming bases. Warren would also require the desecration of war graves.
This country is filled with national cemeteries that honor Americans who fought and died in our wars and many of those cemeteries hold Civil War soldiers from both sides and contain monuments to their sacrifice.
Those soldiers blue and gray Confederate and Union are buried alongside one another and they are for a reason. One side in that conflict was right, the union side and the other was wrong, the Confederate side.
But when it was over, they were all Americans again and allowing them to lie in the same cemeteries next to each other allowed this country to heal its deepest fissure.
But healing is the opposite of what Elizabeth Warren wants to do now. She has no time for healing. Warren profits from hatred and division, particularly racial division, no matter how mindless. Exactly how many dead Confederate soldiers own slaves or even supported slavery? Elizabeth Warren doesn't know. She doesn't care to know.
She wants to humiliate them 150 years after they died, and more to the point their descendants now.
In Arlington National Cemetery just outside Washington, there is a memorial to Confederate troops. Warren's amendment orders the army to tear it down.
This is vandalism, obviously, but it's worse and deeper than that. Healthy societies do not destroy their own history. A country is the sum total of what has happened within it -- good and bad. Without history, you have no country. You just have a collection of banks and check cashing outlets and retail stores.
All of us may have iPhones, but that's not a country. It's obvious. But somehow it's not obvious to Senate Republicans. They support Elizabeth Warren's amendment. The amendment easily emerged from the bipartisan Senate Armed Services Committee.
If the President doesn't veto it, Warren's desecration will become law. Republicans are fine with that. They assume if it does become law, it will be enough, the mob will be sated. The destroyers will have gotten what they wanted and the G.O.P. can return to its preferred agenda for carrying water for big finance.
But they're mistaken in this, because it's never enough. Extremists are never placated. In fact, every success makes them stronger and makes them more radical. We're watching it now. That's why around the country, mobs are not waiting for a vote to destroy history.
They watch rioters loot and burn without being punished, and they took the cue. Now, they're destroying history in many states.
In Richmond, for example, they ripped a statue of Christopher Columbus from its pedestal, and they threw it in a lake. They didn't explain what that might have to do with police brutality. In Philadelphia, they vandalized a statue of an industrialist called Matthias Baldwin. Why him? Well, it wasn't for Civil Rights.
In fact, Matthias Baldwin was such a zealous abolitionist, that before the Civil War, the southern railroads refused to buy his engines. He was on the right side. It doesn't matter. Baldwin lived a long time ago. The statue to him was old, so they wrecked it. It's Year Zero. Nothing that came before can remain.
For that reason, dozens of other monuments have suffered the same fate. Often with the encouragement of our professional class. They're cheering it on, as they always do.
Erin Thompson for example is Professor of Art Crime at New York's John Jay College of Criminal Justice, she says her expertise is, quote, "The damage done to humanity shared heritage through looting, theft, and the deliberate destruction of art."
And yet because everything is irony, Professor Thompson is herself an enthusiastic supporter of destroying our shared heritage in this country, quote, "Use chain instead of rope and it'll go faster." The Professor instructed on Twitter Wednesday night, then she shared even more tips for effectively destroying our monuments.
Nowhere does anyone in authority seem interested in protecting our history and protecting our public spaces from nihilists like Professor Thompson and the mobs she commands.
The police memorial in Richmond, Virginia commemorates the sacrifice of officers killed in the line of duty. It has nothing to do with the Confederacy. You'd think our leaders would defend it, but no, they didn't. The other day, a mob defaced that memorial, and authorities did nothing.
What are our leaders telling us by their negligence in the face of the mob? They're sending a very clear message, which is this. We don't care about you. We don't care about the country. We don't care about your history, your monuments, your rights, or your safety.
Meanwhile, forces of hate and repression are destroying all of these things. As far back as three years ago, CNN employees were calling for the destruction of the Washington Monument and the Jefferson Memorial.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANGELA RYE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: American History is not all glorious, and even though I love John to death, I couldn't disagree more about George Washington. George Washington was a slave owner and we need to call slave owners out for what they are, whether we think they were protecting American freedom or not, he wasn't protecting my freedom.
I wasn't someone who my ancestors weren't deemed human beings to him. And so to me, I don't care if it's a George Washington statue or a Thomas Jefferson statue or a Robert E. Lee statue, they all need to come down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CARLSON: Yes. Thanks for the lecture, idiot. It may happen by the way, at this rate it will, the Washington Monument will be torn down with chains, not ropes. The Jefferson Memorial, too. When that happens, how many lives will be improved? How many people will be happier and will get better jobs? How many will be improved by the desecration of War Graves?
The answer, of course, is none. It's not about improving the lives of anyone of any color, it is about political power. Political power achieved by the oldest means of all force. It's an attempt to legitimize you who vote the wrong way and the society you live in which they hate and want to control.
You think you live in a country with freedom of speech, freedom of religion, equality guaranteed under law. Tough. The documents that celebrate those rights that enshrine them were written by bigots. We tore their statues down. Now, we're in charge.
Is anyone for this, exactly? Anyone? The American people want this? No. Even now, in the middle of our cultural revolution, only 32 percent of Americans say they want Civil War statuary torn down. How about desecrating War Graves? There's no polling on the subject that we could find, but it's hard to believe there's a groundswell of support for this.
Millions of people don't have jobs. Why are we spending time on this? Well, it's happening because a violent mob is forcing its agenda down the throat of our country. Our leaders very much, including Mitch McConnell, and other Republicans in the Senate are too cowardly to resist them.
When asked about the Bill to desecrate national cemeteries, one congressional Republican told journalist Ryan Girdusky, quote, "This isn't the hill to die on." OK, so where is that hill exactly? What won't you let them do to the country? Let us know when you find out.
Now to be clear, because there's no question this will become trending on Twitter, we are not defending the southern Confederacy. We abhor it. Few Americans would defend the southern confederacy and again, we certainly wouldn't. The Confederacy declared war on the United States. We are grateful they lost and that their cause was discredited forever by losing, and it was discredited.
But that's the whole point. The Civil War was the turning point in American history. It shaped who we are now. Eliminating the past leaves us unable to say who we are and that's the point of eliminating it. It's exactly why they're doing it.
Joey Jones is a retired Marine Staff Sergeant, he joins us tonight. Joey, thanks so much for coming on. Just to be completely clear.
JOHNNY "JOEY" JONES, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Good to be here, Tucker. Yes.
CARLSON: This is a form of moral blackmail, in which they use the term confederacy and people are paralyzed. But the truth is, they're trying to destroy evidence of what came before of our history -- good and bad. What does that do to the country?
JONES: You know, I served eight years in the Marine Corps and I never thought twice about what our bases were named after other than the one that was named after a Commandant of the Marine Corps.
And what I'm trying to say there is that what matters today is what in fact, things that happen on us today. So, I don't care about these Confederate generals, I care that Fort Benning is where you go, and you learn how to be an Army Infantryman and you go win a war that saves half the Western world from Nazis. That's what's important.
You know, I don't know what kind of future you're building by tearing down statues so that you offend one half of the people while appeasing the other. But what you can do is bring communities together and build new memorials and build new statues and build a future that looks more like who we are, perhaps, and I'm OK with that conversation.
But to just offend half the people so you can appease the other half, that only divides us, and what it really does is it gives a whole group of politicians an opportunity to say, look, see what I did for you there? Now go vote for me, while their minions go and say, see what your politicians didn't do for you, come to our side. That's what this is really all about.
You stir people's emotions, and you get them to think about stuff that they haven't thought about for a hundred years so that you can divide them and win votes.
CARLSON: Divide them, so I guess what you're saying is this isn't really an effort to bring us together as a nation. It's an effort to divide us along tribal lines.
JONES: That's exactly right. I live in Georgia. I was raised in the south and there was a certain affection for the rebel battle flag growing up that I grew out of, because I joined the United States Marine Corps, and I learned there's only one flag available for my heart, and that's the American flag.
CARLSON: That's right. Amen.
JONES: And you don't get there through bands and taking things out in the middle of the night. You get there through dialogue and communication. What we have now are excuses for leaders trying to draw lines in the sand and they dare is to cross the line.
Where are those leaders that understand building a future together isn't tearing down our past? I don't care what you do with the statues and the rebel flag, but I do care how you lead and where you're going to take us.
That's what's most important to me and you don't go into the future of rebuilding our communities by tearing down statues. That's not how this works.
CARLSON: Well, I strongly agree and appreciate your point about one flag, it is the American flag, you know, under which we all stand. They are against the American flag, though. They have no problem people flying the flag of foreign countries, the Mexican flag at political riots, I find that repugnant, not because I hate Mexico, but because this isn't Mexico, it's America.
I don't understand how they are banning, when it's fine if they, you know, ban on the flags you want, but why they're trying to ban the American flag? That's the one flag you shouldn't ban, correct?
JONES: Well, we don't need to ban anything. We need to look forward and say who are we and what do we stand for? When they came after the Betsy Ross flag, I had it tattooed on my right bicep, not because I knew Betsy Ross but because that was the first step towards the country we have today.
We're only going to get better along the way. And I don't know one person that feels like we're a better country because we're taking down a statue, but I know a lot of people that might feel energized and inspired for the next memorial and monument we put up and a leader that comes forth because right now that's not what we have.
CARLSON: Why don't these people build something once in a while? I can't remember the last thing Elizabeth Warren built or any of the mobs built. They're incapable of building. They're totally incompetent. Good luck running the power grid, by the way. We're looking at --
JONES: Yes, my dad was --
CARLSON: Joey, we're looking at pictures now live of a statue -- I don't even know what statue it is. It is something old. It's being pulled down. Wilmington, Delaware, right on 95 there on the Eastern Seaboard. Unbelievable.
JONES: What are we doing there? Right? Let's build a statue for Corporal Greer that died saving my life. How about that?
CARLSON: Amen. Good to see you tonight. Thank you.
JONES: Thank you.
CARLSON: So, there's a new country on the continent. It's called CHAZ. What is life like inside CHAZ? No police, no laws, no industrial base, and yet it's a paradise on Earth. We'll go deep inside the borders of the new nation.
But first a word from our sponsor tonight, the CHAZ Board of Tourism.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Looking for a relaxing getaway to forget about the election and the coronavirus lockdown. Well, look no further. Welcome to the Nation of CHAZ.
It is the Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone located within beautiful downtown Seattle. It's the anarchist utopia you never knew you needed. Just look at all the things you're missing out on.
A welcoming committee greeting you upon arrival --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAN SPRINGER, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Did not respond to our request for -- a request for information about what they plan to do next.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Luxury accommodations. For the intellectual types, we've got thought provoking artwork. Not wild about cops? Good news because there are none.
Masked men with guns will keep you safe and sound throughout your stay. Even CNN says it's a totally peaceful scene.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If in fact there is going to be Federal officers or Federal law enforcement come to this area, it is not going to be a pretty situation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Oh, what does CNN know? Back to the good stuff. Check out the state of the art port-a-potties.
And for freedom fighters looking for live entertainment, our radicals will serenade you with lovely tunes like this one.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who don't matter?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This mother [bleep].
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who don't matter?
GROUP: This mother [bleep].
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: As you can see, CHAZ has it all. So come on down to the place where everyone is welcome and diversity is appreciated. As long as you're not a capitalist, a mediator, a police officer or someone that stands for the anthem. We'll see you soon.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CARLSON: Last night, we introduced you to the latest addition to our global family of nations, the 196th country on Earth, we're keeping track, it's called CHAZ. CHAZ's gleaming capital rises from land that once belonged to an indigenous, but now nearly extinct tribe known as the Seattle Police Department.
As with so many great nations, the creation story of CHAZ holds innumerable lessons for all of us. It's a tale of unlikely good fortune and the triumph of perseverance over hardship.
How do a group of people with new useful skills, no record of achievement or personal hygiene, a group capable smashing windows and setting fires, but nothing else. How does a group like that create an entirely new nation? That's a question we may soon face here in the United States, in fact, given our current trajectory, it's never easy to build things with people who can only destroy.
And yet, CHAZ pulled it off with grit and determination. This plucky little nation managed to give birth to itself and in the process, a whole new era of democratic self-government. OK, that's overstatement. They haven't actually built anything in CHAZ, it is still mostly graffiti and discarded Starbucks cups, nor is it fully a democracy.
In fact, the country is run by a warlord/rapper called Raz, whose last paying job was renting out his own apartment on Airbnb. It is in other words, a work in progress. But CHAZ does have one functioning institution, it is the Department of Agriculture. It's up and running.
Chaztanians are a proud, independent people and they plan to feed themselves. Take a look at CHAZ's first collective farm. No, it's not Kansas at harvest time. You don't see swaying fields of wheat, but it's a start. The farmers of CHAZ have big dreams.
They imagined several more square feet of kale and organic scallions planted in Dixie cups. And of course, cannabis, lots and lots of stinky indica buds for the people.
The Chaztanians may not know a lot about agriculture, but they have heart, as they often say, as they work the fields, if they could do it in Jonestown, we can do it here.
Naturally, officials in nearby Washington State have become bitterly jealous of this thriving breakaway Republic. Two days ago, Jay Inslee, the small minded Governor of Washington, pretended he had never even heard of CHAZ.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUESTION: I wanted to ask you about what's going on in Seattle, there's a thing called the Capitalism Hill Autonomous Zone. What's your thoughts on the fact that the protesters have taken that over and not allowing people to come and go freely?
GOV. JAY INSLEE (D), WASHINGTON STATE: Well, that's news to me, so I'll have to reserve any comment about it. I have not -- I have not heard anything about that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CARLSON: Never heard of CHAZ. As if. Come on, Governor. Show us the search history on your phone. Every idealistic young pioneer in this country has been compulsively googling CHAZ for days and you haven't? Please, it's ridiculous.
The media, meanwhile, and not surprisingly, have missed the story completely. They're pretending CHAZ isn't even a real country. They're calling it as street fair.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hundreds of demonstrators have been gathering in what is being described as part protest zone, part commune, part street festival.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, the President calls them anarchists and somebody could call it anarchy, but it's more so to the extent that you could call it a community takeover, suggesting that the U.S. military would use force. We're talking about six blocks here.
This is the Capitol Hill neighborhood in the heart of Seattle. We're talking about a six-block area. It's much more of a pedestrian street fair type atmosphere. You have the food trucks that are open. The favorite taco shop is open. There's couches that are out there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CARLSON: Food trucks and a taco shop? The people on television pretend this proud independent nation is some kind of ethnic food festival. No corporate stooges. This isn't about pinatas and dunk tanks. This is nationhood. CHAZ has teeth. CHAZ can bite back as one cable news reporter discovered.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Remember, they want to see this Police Department defunded or even abolished short of some type of major concession. They're not going to leave voluntarily.
And we should point out that Washington is an open carry state and no doubt, some of these protesters are armed, Anderson, so you have to worry about the potential for bloodshed, the potential for violence.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CARLSON: Hear that CHAZ deniers? Chaz has guns. King Raz merely has to say the word and his country's crack Special Forces teams will emerge like ninjas from the shadows. You may not even recognize them as soldiers. Some may look homeless. Others may be injecting narcotics or shoplifting.
But make no mistake, this army means business. They rolled over the Seattle Police Department like Cortez conquering the Aztecs. They'll do it to you, too, CNN. Watch out.
Radio host Jason Rantz is our man on the ground just across the Demilitarized Zone from CHAZ. He joins us tonight. Jason, thanks so much for coming on. Were you able to cross the border today?
JASON RANTZ, SEATTLE RADIO SHOW HOST: Well, I have to tell you that they actually realized that their border was quite porous. There were some cops who were able to get through, so they refortified the borders that are there so that they could keep some of these police invaders from coming actually into their nation.
So, it's a little bit more difficult than usual to get in, but they have actually confirmed that they are in fact armed, and they're keeping track of people who are coming in and out of their nation.
So, they're taking their security as this burgeoning nation very seriously, but they're obviously also having some problems as you just showed the -- what appears to be a farm that was put together by Michael Bloomberg. It literally looks like topsoil on top of ground that they haven't even dug up.
And they realized that maybe it's going to take a little bit longer for them to actually grow some of the foods, so they have a list of some request.
CARLSON: Look, it's a process.
RANTZ: Yes, they're looking for some food, Gatorade, also cigarettes, of course and they're realizing that maybe they don't have enough residents who are willing to do some of the cleanup.
So, of course, the city came in and actually cleaned some of the port-a- potties that were actually delivered by the city to this new nation. So I mean, Seattle is stepping up and giving some help.
CARLSON: There are already NGOs on the ground. I mean, this sounds more like a refugee camp than it does a proud independent nation.
RANTZ: Look, what independent nation that hasn't gone through some of these growing pains, right? It's going to -- they don't really even have a leader. In fact, now they're -- I know we mentioned Raz Simone. There's some concern that he doesn't actually represent everyone. And it turns out there hasn't been an election. Maybe there will be, perhaps they'll ask for IDs for people to vote.
So, I as a South Lake Union resident of Seattle, don't get a say in picking their leader, but we'll see.
CARLSON: May I ask, you said at the outset that CHAZ has fortified his borders. Did anybody point out that that's racist? And I'm pretty sure that's racist borders are racist, right?
RANTZ: Borders are racist, but their progressive Seattle-lites and they're very woke. So, obviously if they're doing it, it can't be racist.
CARLSON: It still seems racist to me. You think you'll be able to get in tomorrow? Over the weekend?
RANTZ: That's your privilege. I will try to get in over the weekend. We'll see what it actually looks like. I'm going to try to not get a contact high, as I'm walking through, as was the case yesterday. There's a lot of weeping smoke there and someone actually walked up to us and they said, where can we smoke and I said, it's CHAZ, I think you can pretty much smoke wherever it is you want.
CARLSON: Ah, that's the America they're planning for us. Jason Rantz, outside CHAZ, on the DMZ. Good to see you tonight. Thank you.
RANTZ: Good to see you.
CARLSON: Scott Adams, of course is the creator of "Dilbert," also the author of a new book called "Loser Think: How the Untrained Brains are Ruining America." A title that is demonstrably true.
Scott Adams, great to see you tonight. What do you make of this? You've lived in this country a long time. Were you aware that you could just create your own independent nation within its borders?
SCOTT ADAMS, CREATOR, "DILBERT" COMIC STRIPT: Aware of it? I was inspired by it. I turned my house into an autonomous zone. But two days in, I'm having little problems. I'm running out of food and the U.N. wouldn't accept me unless I denounce Israel and change my name from Scotland. Apparently, that's taken.
So, I'm quite interested in their experiment. Actually, in all seriousness, I'm completely in favor of them trying this out because it's going to be the world's greatest learning experience.
The first thing they learned is, hey, I think we need some kind of a police force. Then they learned, maybe some kind of a border, and you know what would really be good, food and some kind of a system to make money to get that food.
So I think we should actually be looking for reproducing little tests around the country. This is a bad one because they took over other people's, you know, stuff and their territory. I think they can compensate for that with some kind of reparations later.
But you know, if you did a clean test where you just picked the place and said, let's plan it from the ground up and build a system that's not racist, it gives us everything we need.
I'd love to see that actually, seriously, we'd love to see that because some of the experiments about getting rid of the police are really something like changing it into a police-like structure with a little less of the gun stuff and a little more of the services stuff. I'd like to see how that works.
How do you move forward unless you test stuff? So, I'm actually quite open minded about it.
CARLSON: So, let me ask you though. I'm struck by the people building this new society and in fact, the ones marching through our streets demanding that we all build a new society, almost without exception have no skills.
These are people who've never created anything, never done anything, many don't have jobs. They seem like the most helpless and least impressive people in our society, shouldn't your society kind of defer to the people who are creating things and adding to the sum total? Or no?
ADAMS: Well, that's the learning experience. You know, there are some things you can't learn from, you know, listening to people and watching TV and reading a book. The fact that they're living there and they've actually, you know, built their own little city or town or country, whatever it is.
And they have to figure out how to make it work and it is slowly dawning on them that they would end up recreating all the systems that they opposed because nobody has a better idea. That's how they evolved to where they were in the first place.
But I'm all in favor. Like I say that, you know, a lot of our systems were designed before the internet, you know, are you telling me we can't design a better policing system., still with some police, you still need some muscle sometimes, but you couldn't design something that's better using all the technology that's been designed since the first police officer wore a badge?
CARLSON: So, I guess, I would just say though, this isn't really bad. It's not an experiment because the infrastructure and the food, everything one needs to live is being supplied by the adults outside.
This really is like setting up a model country in your parents' garage. Right? I mean, why don't they go out into the desert Nevada and build a country, no? Themselves?
ADAMS: Well, I think that's where they should go. I mean, what they've learned from this is that you can't take over something that was built for some other purpose, for all kinds of reasons. That it doesn't work. You know, somebody else owns it. Somebody's going to kick you out eventually.
So, but I think that's exactly where they should go. They should propose let's build something. Maybe we can get people to leave us alone and see if it works.
CARLSON: I'm totally for that.
ADAMS: A lot of things have been tried, but I don't think you would try those same things. I don't think you would just build a commune of the types that didn't work in the past.
But I think there's some amount of creativity that could lower the cost of living, maybe have some kind of maybe security camera system, some kind of organized, neighborhood watch.
In fact, my neighborhood is doing that right now. We just -- my neighborhood just put in cameras and organized a neighborhood watch.
CARLSON: I bet you live in a nice neighborhood, rural America has very few police, they don't need them. Other places need more, I would say.
Scott, great to see you. Thanks so much.
ADAMS: Thank you.
CARLSON: Before we go to break, we have been tough on the rioters and the looters, as you know, but we want to be fair on the show and give you both sides.
So, this is a photograph taken by our friend, a frequent guest on the show Seth Barron. It's graffiti. It's spray painted on Wooster Street in Downtown Manhattan. It says "David Frum deserves scorn." And you know what? Being honest, it's hard to disagree with that.
Yes, it's vandalism, obviously, we're against that, but it's also true, David Frum of "The Atlantic" Magazine does deserve scorn A lot of it. In fact, the awfulness of David Frum maybe the only thing the left and right still agree on in this country. It was a brief moment of national consensus and we want to bring it to you. We'll be back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CARLSON: Increasingly, American police are treated as an invading army, maybe the Confederate Army. In Minneapolis, rioters invaded and burned down a police precinct building. In response to this, the City Council did not support the police. They blamed the police and vowed to disband the entire police department. The police shows "Live P.D." and "Cops" have now been canceled.
In the City of Boston, Berklee College of Music has issued a formal apology for the crime of allowing uniformed police officers to use the men's room. At Berklee College of Music, the bathrooms are segregated, it turns out.
In Miami, some mostly peaceful protesters attacked a police car and when the officers responded, the rest of the mostly peaceful protesters made it clear how they felt. Watch this.
[VIDEO CLIP PLAYS]
CARLSON: Miami, by the way, is one of the few remaining American cities where the city leaders don't hate their own city and themselves and so they allow the police to respond with force to force as they ought to be allowed to do.
But it doesn't change the fact that police everywhere are getting an awful lot of hatred directed at them, and under these circumstances, you shouldn't be shocked to learn a lot of police are thinking of going and doing something else.
Tulsa Police Major Travis Yates just wrote a very moving essay about that. He joins us tonight. Mr. Yates, thanks so much. Officer, thanks for coming on tonight.
MAJOR TRAVIS YATES, TULSA POLICE DEPARTMENT: Thanks for having me, Tucker.
CARLSON: So, you wrote a piece that has gone around, maybe some of our viewers have seen it. I found it really bracing and essentially you said, why would people want to continue doing this? Summarize what you wrote, if you would.
YATES: you know, it's pretty wild, Tucker. I wrote that Monday night late and it was almost like God was with me when I wrote it, because it just flowed in about nine or ten minutes, and quite honestly, when I got done with it, I wasn't sure I liked it and I uploaded it and I called my editor the very next morning, I said, we ought to think about maybe taking that down, right?
And of course, he didn't take it down. And the rest is history. But I think I was pulling the emotions from officers around the country and what they're feeling. Tucker, very much so, we're the silent majority.
Officers are afraid to speak out. They're afraid to talk, just like the article said, you're on your next call away from being canceled or destroyed. And, and so officers feel very limited. I think citizens do, too. And we had just as many citizens that comment on that article and sent us great e-mails on that.
CARLSON: So, you say in the piece, I mean, I'm sure there are clearly cops who shouldn't be cops, they are there for the wrong reasons, but your profile seems more common to me. You're the son of a cop. You always wanted to do it. You really believe in the job.
But you're not getting rich doing it. Are you going to continue doing it? Are your friends who are police officers going to continue doing it? What effect is this going to have?
YATES: Well, I think, you know, Ferguson was a tough time for us because as everybody knows, from President Obama's administration, they found no evidence of wrongdoing in Ferguson, even though the narrative is quite different.
CARLSON: Yes, I know.
YATES: And so law enforcement morale went really, really low during that time period, and we kind of came out of that, and we were kind of making a resurgence in recent years, and this has just been devastating. This is Ferguson times a thousand.
And every department, every officer you talk to is looking to leave. Some of them obviously can't. They have families. They've got jobs. But the officers that are probably struggling, most of the officers with 10 to 15 years on because you can't really leave yet, but I've heard from hundreds of people that are so discouraged, they want to leave.
They love the job, Tucker. They love the community. They love the people. But all of this chaos is just wearing on them every single day.
CARLSON: So, what kind of people are going to want to become cops? So, if we did this to the Navy SEALS and said the Navy SEALS are evil, presumably, impressive people wouldn't want to be Navy SEALS. Who is going to want to become a police officer under these circumstances? Only the worst people, I'm afraid.
YATES: Yes, it's really -- when you think about it, it is the only profession that still kind of cold and discriminated against. It's kind of cool to spit in people's food. It's kind of cool to cuss that because we're supposed to just sit there and take it, the article talked about that.
And it's really amazing what they expect, you know, human beings to put up with and it takes a toll on our men and women and I've seen that in their eyes.
And there's only so long you can do that, Tucker and so we've got to have the risk enough to do it, and right now, unfortunately, the risk is too high and it's a struggle because they want to stay, they want to do the job. But they have to look at the risk that the very next day they could literally be destroyed for doing everything right.
CARLSON: Yes, people calling you racist for no reason. I mean, if you -- the police are important, we need good police. We should do everything we can to weed out the bad ones, but support the good ones and make sure good people want to become cops.
Last question, to you Major Yates, are you optimistic at all about the future of law enforcement? I mean, how worried are you?
YATES: Well, I'm extremely concerned and you mentioned racist earlier, and the bar has been set so low for that, Tucker, and that's really concerning. It's the worst thing you can call a police officer.
I've been branded that for years now, and now, it's almost at a high pitch. I could be the most hated police officer in America right now, all because I have the audacity to talk about that. I did not believe there was systematic racism in policing. I have the data to show it.
And what happened was because that narrative was completely against what other narratives are, they twisted what I said and said that I think we should kill more black people. It's just outrageous. It's absolutely outrageous. And they have nearly destroyed me and my family.
So, the risks are so extreme. It's very much a struggle. But I pray that you know, the profession can come back. It came back once before, but this almost seems like too much.
CARLSON: It feels that way to me, too. We're proud to have you on. I know you've taken a lot of criticism. I think it's unfair. I think it distorts what you said, and we're happy to have you on the show. Major Yates, thanks.
YATES: Thank you.
CARLSON: Well, much of America has reopened now from coronavirus and in some states, cases are rising. Is that a reason to panic? You may have heard it is. Dr. Marc Siegel assesses it after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CARLSON: Coronavirus lockdowns are ending and in some states new cases are rising. Is that a problem for the country? What does it mean exactly? You know who we turn to for information on the subject, Fox medical contributor, Dr. Marc Siegel joins us tonight. Hey, Doctor.
DR. MARC SIEGEL, FOX NEWS MEDICAL CONTRIBUTOR: Hi, Tucker. Two months ago, today, April 12, 2020 was a dark day for America. That day, we first went ahead of Italy as the number one country in the world in terms of deaths from COVID-19. We became number one.
Tucker, that day was also Easter Sunday, a very dark day for America. Luckily, it's in the rearview mirror, and we can look back at it and hopefully and I believe tonight, I can tell you, I think the worst is over. But we have to look at lessons learned.
What did we learn? We learned that hospitals can't be overwhelmed. We learned we need a lot of testing for COVID-19 in the United States. We learned about contact tracing that we have to track who is in contact with the people that get it, and we learned about not to overreact to a single positive test. We learned to protect our most vulnerable populations.
I want to tell you tonight, I think Florida seems to have learned those lessons and to your headline, the number of positive tests are going up in Florida because they're testing more. The percentage of positive tests is not going up. I think that's reassuring for Florida where my parents are.
But Arizona, I am concerned about. Arizona has some problems. There's more hospitalizations going on. There's bars and gyms that are open. There's not enough social distancing at pools. There's not enough social distancing at restaurants.
The Native American population is at risk because of diabetes and other problems that are not being looked after enough. Nursing homes, we've talked about that on the show here, Tucker. Nursing homes in Arizona worry me because there's not enough infection control.
So, I say to Arizona tonight, learn from where New York went, other than the nursing home, which was a horrible plight here. Learned from Wisconsin, which has been open for a month, Tucker and has done very, very well because of social distancing, and testing. Learn from Wisconsin, Arizona, learn from Florida.
And I hope they learn those lessons, because so far, they haven't reached the surge capacity the hospitals, and I want to keep it that way. Overall, the news in the United States stays good.
Finally, a message to my parents tonight down in Florida. You've heard me talk about my father on this show. They're doing well, hunkered down, cocooned in Florida, Tucker.
I'm going to send them a message. We're coming for you soon. It's almost time -- Tucker.
CARLSON: Dr. Siegel, thanks so much for that. Good to see you.
SIEGEL: Thank you, Tucker.
CARLSON: American cities have a lot of problems, rioting right now, homeless encampments have been there for a while and coronavirus. Soon, they won't have police, why live there?
Our next guest says the revival of rural America is on the way. That's the answer. He is just ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CARLSON: If you've lived in a big American city over the last year, you might feel like you want to get out now. You're stuck in an apartment, your Mayor let looters burn your neighborhood, people around you are miserable. They're mad.
You may be dreaming about moving out of the city to somewhere pastoral to rural America. Raj Peter Bhakta did that. He was a star of "The Apprentice." He ran for Congress. He started a company, started a farm, didn't go well. Then he moved to rural Vermont and became a massive success. He says you can do something like that, too.
Raj Bhakta joins us tonight. Raj, thanks so much for coming on. So, your story is the story that I think a lot of people are dreaming about, like I want to get out of Manhattan, but like what is there for me to do? What is there for people to do outside of the cities?
RAJ PETER BHAKTA, ENTREPRENEUR: Well, Tucker, there's never been a better time to move to rural America. And I think that people have got a conception that, you know, moving out to the country reduces opportunity. But if you've got an optimistic revival, you know, positive mentality, you can find a niche like I did, in whiskey, for example, where you can take advantage of the immense bounty of this country, right from sea to shining sea outside of the coast, where you can have a higher quality of life.
You know, we can have a revival of optimism, happiness, family, community, all of these good things, and this is an opportunity to reassess that. You can move out, you can find a niche, right, in rural America and build a fortune, like I have.
CARLSON: You did, but -- so for people watching, they're thinking, well, I would love to start a business in rural America, but who's going to work there? There's no workforce. You've built this company Whistlepig. You hired people to help you. How hard is that?
BHAKTA: Look, I mean, getting good people is always a challenge. It's a challenge in the city. It's a challenge in the country. But again, I go back to the revivalist mentality, the revival of rural America mentality.
If you have the right mentality, you're going to attract the right people, and you'll be able to coalesce them and bring them to, you know, to bear on the project at hand.
So, you know, it starts with a mindset, Tucker, right? If you have the positive mindset, right, and you're going out and you've come to the country, and you'll find a niche.
CARLSON: Right, you're a product of cities. Would you ever move back to a big city? Would you ever move back to Manhattan? San Francisco?
BHAKTA: You know, for basic, you know, health and safety, there's no way I would move back to a big city right now. There's no question about it.
CARLSON: So, you're not surprised that real estate prices appear to be going up in Boise and Coeur d'Alene and Bozeman and maybe in Vermont where you are. I mean people -- you think they are going to start to move there?
BHAKTA: No, people are coming on and then they are coming up and it's a great thing. Right? So, if you -- and there is a much better quality of life, for raising families, to homeschool your kids if you want. You get a little dirt under your fingernails. And again, find opportunity. You know find opportunity like, you know, the brandy that I'm launching, which is phenomenal. And you know, it sold out its first release.
You know -- you just -- if you look and you pay attention and you know, you stay open to the signs of where opportunity are, it's all over this country. It's the greatest country in the world.
CARLSON: I believe that. We don't have to live like this. People are waking up to that fact. We don't have to live like this and I hope more and more people decide not to.
BHAKTA: That's true.
CARLSON: It's an inspiring story.
BHAKTA: And I want to say, Tucker, as a minority, I was a little afraid to come on your show. But I wanted to tell you and other white people that I remain their friends as a minority.
CARLSON: Ah, Raj Bhakta, great to see you. Thanks so much for that.
That's it for us tonight. We will keep tabs on CHAZ over the weekend. See you, Monday.
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