'Sunday Morning Futures' on business in China, infrastructure bill

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Former DNI Ratcliffe on Corporate America's dealings in China

Former Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe discusses U.S. companies doing business in China and COVID cases surging at the border.

This is a rush transcript from "Sunday Morning Futures," August 8, 2021. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

MARIA BARTIROMO, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Good Sunday morning, everyone. Welcome to "Sunday Morning Futures." I'm Maria Bartiromo.

Today: caving to the pressure. The final countdown is on, on infrastructure. Did the Republicans just enable the massive tax-and-spend Green New Deal?

Coming up, North Dakota Senator Kevin Cramer takes us behind the deal, and he explains his vote.

Then: dividing us once again, pointing the finger at the unvaccinated over and over again, while Biden's wide-open border spreads COVID across the country, as the war of words with Florida Governor Ron DeSantis escalates.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. RON DESANTIS (R-FL): I guess I'm not surprised that Biden doesn't remember me. I guess the question is, what else has he forgotten?

(LAUGHTER)

DESANTIS: Biden's forgotten about the crisis at our Southern border. I can tell you that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BARTIROMO: Former Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe on the hypocrisy at the border and the road to China dominance running through corporate America.

Plus: Governor Cuomo takes it to the mat. His legal team comes out swinging. New York Congresswoman Elise Stefanik on her calls for impeachment and arrest on the sexual harassment charges of the governor.

Then: Let them eat cake. They partied like it was 1999 last night at Obama's mansion on Martha's Vineyard, as Biden teases new mandates on masking up.

And Michelle Obama teams up with failed Georgia gubernatorial candidate Stacey Abrams to -- quote -- "change the future of this nation." Candace Owens Candace Owens on the race-baiting and the power-grabbing.

All that right here, right now on "Sunday Morning Futures."

And now breaking news: The Senate is in the final minutes of agreeing to a $1.2 trillion infrastructure bill, which has been criticized for only giving 23 percent to hard infrastructure, like roads, bridges and ports.

The Wall Street Journal's Kim Strassel got into the debate on Friday, writing in The Journal this op-ed: "This bill is better viewed as step one of President Biden's Green New Deal, giving his appointees and federal bureaucrats tens of billions with which to remake the economy."

So, why did 17 GOP senators vote to proceed? On the baser end of the scale, here's the dirty little secret. The bill fundamentally amounts to a heap of spending, and some Republicans can spend with the best of Democrats.

Let's ask one of those senators who voted yes to this bill.

Joining me right now is North Dakota Senator Kevin Cramer. He sits on the Senate Banking and Armed Services committees.

Senator, why are you in favor of this bill? Are you betraying the Republican base?

(LAUGHTER)

SEN. KEVIN CRAMER (R-ND): Not at all, Maria. And thanks for the opportunity.

In addition to those two committees, I also serve on the Environment and Public Works Committee and happen to be the ranking Republican on the Transportation -- Highway Transportation Infrastructure -- or Transportation Infrastructure Subcommittee.

And just to do a little math for Kim, who's generally very, very bright, we have -- in addition to the bill that came out of the -- out of the -- our committee, and then this compromise, of the $1.2 trillion, $450 billion -- that's over a third of it -- is not just infrastructure. It's roads and bridges specifically.

In addition to that, there's ports, waterways, railroads, airports, broadband, all of which are critical to the movement of goods and services around this country and around the world.

We couldn't get North Dakota soybeans to South Korea if we didn't have ports in the Northwest, Pacific Northwest. And we certainly couldn't get pasta to New York without trucks getting the wheat from the field to the bins and then off to the mills and the factories.

So, I like Kim Strassel a lot. I think she's very bright. She is just very, very wrong on this one, both in the math and in the purpose of it.

BARTIROMO: Well, wrong?

Let's look at what's in the bill.

CRAMER: Sure.

BARTIROMO: First of all, let me ask you, is there any money in this bill that goes to the border? Is there any acknowledgement from the -- acknowledgement from the Biden administration that we're in a border crisis and he needs to address it?

Any money here in the border? Because I see resilience and water storage, environmental remediation, Energy Department, power infrastructure, electric vehicles, nuclear companies, a lot of beginnings to the Green New Deal.

CRAMER: Well, first of all, cybersecurity and resiliency of the grid is not exclusive to the Green New Deal.

I think we have all experienced the problems with a lack of resiliency to our energy infrastructure. I mean, the Colonial Pipeline cyberattack was a pretty good example of that.

Now, are there some things that Democrats like? For sure. Are there some things missing that we would love? Of course there are. But this is a 50/50 Senate. Democrats have a majority in the House and the White House. So you're going to have to take some of those things to get all the other really good things.

And all of those other things that you have referenced aren't, again, exclusively Democratic principles.There are some other things that -- some of those things that contribute to the overall infrastructure of our country. And this is all hard infrastructure, Maria.

You might argue some of it. I don't like the electric vehicle charging stations, for example. If I was king, I wouldn't -- I wouldn't support that. But, fortunately, our founders gave us something other than a king.

BARTIROMO: Well, you're not a king. None of the Republicans are king. But it certainly seems like the Democrats act like kings.

In addition to all of that money beginning a Green New Deal, it also dictates roles in areas that have traditionally been managed by local authorities, like drinking water, even as it muscles in on private sector enterprises like broadband.

So, once again, we see the Democrats taking power away from the governors and putting it on the federal level. Is that fair?

CRAMER: It is not fair. It may be fair in a couple of areas in regards to broadband for example, but -- or water, for example.

But here's one thing that I fought really hard for, permitting reforms, such as maintaining the permitting reforms that we put -- Donald Trump put in as an order. He -- remember, he had the rule that created the one federal agency -- or one federal decision rule that took 10-year projects down to two years. Remember that whole 10-years to two-year argument.

Well, Joe Biden repealed that on the very first day in office. We have -- we're codifying it in this law for roads and bridges.That's a major reform to permitting, along with agency coordination. It's what allows us to -- agencies to do things collaboratively and collectively, rather than consecutively, shortening the time frame. It extends the permitting council that was implemented four or five years ago.

And that's for large private sector infrastructure projects that include water projects, large -- large highway projects, Corps of Engineers projects. So there's some major reforms there that would never been agreed to by Democrats.

BARTIROMO: Yes.

CRAMER: Now, with regard to the Southern border, obviously, we're not going to get Democrats to agree to a bill that builds a wall.

I think that would be pretty cool, but...

BARTIROMO: Well, why not?

CRAMER: Why not? Because...

BARTIROMO: Why not? Why not just work for the American people?

We have got a wide-open border. We have got 6,000 people coming across the border every single day, 210,000 apprehended in the month of July. Why not demand that they fix the border before anything else?

And, by the way, are these pay-fors fictional? I mean, the Committee For a Responsible Federal Budget says that the infrastructure plan will add $400 billion to the deficit. Kim writes in The Journal that all of these pay- fors are actually fictional.

And let me just end this question with President Trump's commentary on it, because President Trump also had a statement on the infrastructure package.

And he says: "Joe Biden's infrastructure bill is a disgrace. It will be used against the Republican Party in the upcoming elections in 2022 and 2024. It will be very hard for me to endorse anyone foolish enough to vote in favor of this deal."

And you say?

CRAMER: Well, he didn't give one reason why it's a bad deal, other than its Joe Biden's.

And I understand that, and I understand his frustration. And he's obviously got influence and has a legitimate opinion. But the fact of the matter is, the American public, including the vast majority of Republicans, are very supportive of this.

Everybody from the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and the Business Roundtable to my local convenience stores and labor unions support this bill. There's some nearly 200 organizations that have come out in support of this bill.

We need roads and bridges. And we're falling behind our competitors, particularly China...

BARTIROMO: Yes.

CRAMER: ... with regard to transportation infrastructure.

It is what moves goods and services around the world.

BARTIROMO: Yes.

CRAMER: So, I think he's wrong on this issue.

BARTIROMO: No, I recognize there's a lot of support for this on both sides, definitely a lot of support in this. I get that.

Real quick on these amendments.

CRAMER: Sure.

BARTIROMO: How much of the revenue raise is coming from new regulations and fees around crypto?

CRAMER: Yes.

BARTIROMO: And tell me specifically when you are going to open the door for this debate on the $5.5 trillion spending plan? Are you trying to get this through by Wednesday of this upcoming week?

CRAMER: Well, we would like to get it through by Wednesday, preferably by Monday, and, better yet, today, if it's at all possible.

In terms of opening the door, the Democrats are going to do a much larger, jam it down your throat, tax and spending, reckless deal. There's nothing that's going to stop that from happening.

By passing this, however, we take hard infrastructure off the table for them, because that's part of the negotiation with the moderate Democrats. And we make the next deal much more difficult politically for moderate Democrats to support.

So, we actually, in passing this, I think have created a political advantage for moderates and for conservatives in this country, because, if we don't do this, the other -- the other outcome would be, why would moderate Democrats ever trust or negotiate with Republicans again while they're in the majority, when they could just blow up the filibuster? And we will be giving them every -- every argument to do so, Maria.

So, I think we're going to get this through. I don't expect that we will get final passage before probably late tomorrow, or maybe even Tuesday morning.

BARTIROMO: OK.

CRAMER: And it'll be a good move in the right direction.

And then they're going to -- they're going to open up the floodgates, I don't think there's any question, at which time we will use this bill and every other argument possible to fight against the real opponent here, and that is the progressives in the Democratic Party that are running their organization.

BARTIROMO: Yes.

All right, Senator, great to get your insights on this. Thanks very much.

We will be watching what this means for the larger tax increases that are coming to the American people.

We will have much more in just a moment, as we look ahead on "Sunday Morning Futures." Stay with us.

We have got Elise Stefanik on the other side of this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BARTIROMO: Well, welcome back.

President Biden continues to shame anyone who has not been vaccinated, calling the Delta surge a pandemic of the unvaccinated, as his administration readies for more rules at any moment.

Joining me right now is the third-ranking Republican in the House of Representatives. She is New York Congresswoman Elise Stefanik on the phone this morning.

And, Congresswoman, it's great to see you. Thanks very much for being here.

Want to get your take on our civil liberties. This is a major issue. New York City just became the first major city to require proof of vaccination at restaurants, performances and gyms. De Blasio is on his way out.

What are you thinking in terms of where we are with COVID and the potential for more lockdowns?

REP. ELISE STEFANIK (R-NY): Well, first of all, every American should be outraged.

We're seeing the chipping away of our civil liberties across the country. And New York City, unfortunately, is ground zero for this. Now our restaurant owners are becoming law enforcement officers and having to make the tough decisions.

And individuals are coming in with vaccine cards. Some of them are counterfeit cards. This is not the role of our restaurants. We also should not have policies that segregate those who have been vaccinated or not vaccinated.

And the other group of constituents I'm hearing from, Maria, is concerned parents, this discussion about getting back to school in person. We all want to make sure our kids get back to school in person. But there's already discussions about a mask mandate, which is not based upon science.

We know that our kids, so, so few are affected by COVID. So there are concerns. And, unfortunately, I think this is the overall politicization of the CDC.

BARTIROMO: Yes.

Well, I'm wondering if we're going to be sitting in fear until the 2022 midterm elections, conveniently, Congresswoman, because now you have, obviously, audits going on. The last time you were with me, you said that you supported the audit going on in Arizona. We know that Michelle Obama is teaming up with Stacey Abrams for this federal election takeover legislation, H.R.1.

Yesterday, Nancy Pelosi says she's confident that Democrats will keep the House in 2022. Are you expecting a fair and free election for the midterms? Or are we going to be on lockdown again, ensuring mail-in ballots are the standard?

STEFANIK: Well, Republicans need to do everything we can to ensure free and fair elections. That means passing election integrity and election security laws at the state level.

And I think it's the height of hypocrisy when you have the Texas state Democrats traveling, becoming super-spreaders of COVID, and they're traveling in opposition to a commonsense election security bill that would ensure secure integrity of elections in the state of Texas.

So, we need to make sure that we're doing this in all states and do everything we can to fight back against the universal mail ballots, where there's no signature verification, where there's no voter I.D. So I am concerned, Maria. This is why Republicans need to continue to speak out.

BARTIROMO: Yes.

I mean, look, you had a Democrat Congressional Campaign Committee chair yesterday warning that -- it was a closed-door meeting for the party. And they said that -- he said, if the midterms were held today, they would lose the majority because they can't win on policy.

STEFANIK: Well, he's exactly right. They are going to lose the majority, whether it's today or next November.

Look at the Biden border crisis. Look at the inflation crisis across the country. Look at the unraveling of our civil liberties, the attacks on our constitutional liberties. The American people know that this is not the right direction. We're moving in a far left socialist direction.

We need to focus on economic growth, on reopening the economy safely, on ensuring kids get back to school, and commonsense policies, which is not what we're seeing from Joe Biden, Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer.

BARTIROMO: All right, let's turn to Governor Cuomo.

You are obviously representing New York and have a pinned tweet right now out saying you are calling for the arrest of Cuomo and, of course, an impeachment trial as well.

His lawyers fought back yesterday. They took it to the mat. Here is one of them, Rita Glavin, on that -- on that presser we saw yesterday. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RITA GLAVIN, ATTORNEY FOR GOVERNOR ANDREW CUOMO: He is 63 years old. He has spent 40 years in public life. And for him to all of a sudden be accused of a sexual assault of an executive assistant that he really doesn't know doesn't pass muster.

He needs to be treated fairly. And this would become, if you accept this report as is, without giving him the evidence, I tell you that is irresponsible and a new standard for impeachment.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BARTIROMO: New standard for impeachment, Congresswoman.

Yes, two systems of justice is what they're going with, which is, of course, what we have seen against President Trump for the last four years. Your thoughts?

STEFANIK: Well, it was a shameful defense.

Instead of focusing on the legal aspects, they chose to shame multiple victims, including a New York state trooper who was sexually assaulted and sexually harassed.

Look, this was an independent investigation conducted by the New York attorney general that the governor asked for. Governor Cuomo asked for this investigation himself. He said he had full faith in this investigation, over 175 witnesses, over 74,000 pieces of evidence. The evidence shows that he broke federal law, state law.

In addition to the sexual harassment and sexual assault, there was illegal retaliation against the victims. In addition, Maria, this is not just when he was governor, but there have been instances where he sexually harassed women when he was HUD secretary. That's been out in the media as well.

He needs to be impeached. The Democrats in Albany have been slow-walking this up until this point. We have reached a breaking point. We need to make sure that there's equal justice under the law. And whether you're the most powerful elected official in New York state, laws apply to you just like they do to every other New Yorker.

BARTIROMO: Well, look, he's wanting more time.

Is the time situation on his side? What do you want to see happen next week? Because his lawyers are saying, look, the A.G. released everything to the public, making the public make its own assessment, without his legal team having the right time to go through everything.

STEFANIK: Well, the governor does want to use time as his ally. He is digging in, and they are looking for any opportunity for him to cling onto power.

Again, they have been effective at bullying Democrats in the state legislature for years, not just the past few months. That's why it's very important to have the state Assembly and state Senate start the impeachment hearings with alacrity, as quickly as possible.

And the New York -- New Yorkers have spoken. Over 75 percent of New Yorkers do not believe -- they believe he should step down. If he doesn't step down, they believe he should be impeached.

So, this is crystal clear. But we cannot allow Democrats in the state legislature to slow-walk this. Every voter needs to hold their state elected official accountable for how they move forward on this important issue.

BARTIROMO: All right, Congresswoman, it's great to catch up with you this morning. Please come back soon.

Thanks very much, Congresswoman Elise Stefanik. Thank you so much.

Coming up: One of the leading CEOs in America gets approval to own his bank in China. Jamie Dimon makes the case, after investors lose a trillion dollars when the CCP's winds change on business in the month of July.

We will get into it next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BARTIROMO: Well, the communist China crackdown continued this week, with the CCP changing the rules on the video game manufacturers, after similar edicts on education companies, ride-hailing companies and technology companies.

I had the chance to catch up with the chairman and CEO of J.P. Morgan, Jamie Dimon, this week as he gets ready to expand in China. JPM was granted permission to own full control of a securities business in China.

I started by noting the massive sell-off in Chinese stocks in the month of July, with some $400 billion in investor losses, because the CCP decided to change the rules and issue new edicts on business.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JAMIE DIMON, CHAIRMAN, J.P. MORGAN CHASE: You and I have been around the block, older, right? How many times have we seen stuff like this? I'm not breathless over it.

And I think the biggest issue, which you have mentioned before, which I agree with you, I would say, about 15 years ago, the business community and the government should have started focusing on China. And we didn't, not because we're bad.

It's just people were kind of happy. They thought that China would change over time. And they didn't. And we should have focused on it. And now we are. So, I think the right thing to do is, they are a strategic competitor. They are using unfair subsidies in some cases try to win in global markets and stuff like that.

And we should have proper policies. We can do them unilaterally. They can do them unilaterally. I don't think you are going to see a decoupling. I think you are going to see -- you have already seen most of a massive restructuring.

BARTIROMO: Yes, but it's not just a competitive situation. They're making edicts that are impacting you.

JPM was one of the lead underwriters on DiDi Global. And then they decide to undermine DiDi Global.

DIMON: Yes.

BARTIROMO: How much money did J.P. Morgan lose on the DiDi Global deal?

DIMON: That's life in the fast lines.

BARTIROMO: Did you -- did you change? Is it going to sway you in any way on being the manager for the next big China deal?

DIMON: It might.

But I, again, don't get breathless over it. We do business in 100 countries. And when we do it, we do it under the laws of those lands and under the law of America as they apply. Think of Foreign Corrupt Practices Act, sanctions and OFAC and things like that, so that we will adopt and change so we can serve our clients in the proper way under the law.

And foreign policy is set by the American government. It's not set by J.P. Morgan. I am not as worried about China as everybody else. And, remember, America can do things unilaterally. If we don't want to buy Huawei, we don't. If we don't want to do X, we don't. If we don't want to buy something -- and they can do the same thing.

Countries have the right to do unilateral things. And my guess is, we will find a common ground. And the strategic -- and America's doing the right thing, by the way, to reaching out to our allies. Our biggest weapon is our allies to set global terms of trade, and about all these issues you read about, tariffs and steel and stuff, subsidies and stuff like that. I'm not as worried about it as other people.

America will still be the most prosperous nation on the planet. It'll be smaller than China, but still for more prosperous in 20 years.

BARTIROMO: Maybe.

But the -- Xi Jinping and his colleagues want to overtake the United States as the number one superpower.

They used 2020 to gain more ground. They invaded India and they killed soldiers. They went into Hong Kong. They started throwing all the freedom fighters in jail. They have Xinjiang and slave labor right now. Two administrations, the Trump administration and the Biden administration, both told us that they are committing genocide.

You're Jamie Dimon. People look at you for leadership. You're going to go in there and open up shop now and expand your operations in China, after what we know about the CCP?

DIMON: We have had plans for like 30 years about going in China.

And, unfortunately, what you just said, you could say about a lot of countries around the world. When we do something in a foreign country, we follow American foreign policy. You may not believe this, but American foreign policy wants a J.P. Morgan to properly expand to serve American companies, other companies, and to be part of that.

If at the point in time, they decide they don't want us to do it, we simply will not do it. And so it's not -- it's not every country can do whatever - - company can do whatever it wants.

So -- and, again, I'm not -- those -- some of those things you mentioned are terrible, I think they're barking up the wrong tree.

BARTIROMO: The fact that you know they don't have to adhere to our U.S. accounting standards, they don't have to now until 2023, how can you justify investing in these companies when you don't even know if the earnings are real?

And, by the way, they could be tied to the Chinese military that is trying to overtake this country.

DIMON: Well, that's a -- that's a different issue.

If it relates to national security, the American government's going to tell me what to do. And I will salute. I'm a patriot way before I run J.P. Morgan. So that's what we follow. We speak to them all the time about things like this.

And so your -- as I said, we do business in a lot of countries. A lot of critters don't have the same accounting principles, the same rule of law, the same ownership principles, the same enterprise. We still do business in those countries on that land. And, over time, the world is better off for it.

So I'd be a little cautious to get too breathless over this particular issue.

BARTIROMO: I understand.

But I do think that this is -- as it relates to China, it is national security. I have a couple of questions from some shareholders or viewers. Do you expect your credit card customers to have any privacy? Are you going to have to send all their data to the CCP? Do you think you're going to operate on a level playing field?

DIMON: Look, I get...

BARTIROMO: What about upstream dividends from the bank?

Are you -- are you -- do you really believe...

DIMON: These are shareholders asking these questions?

BARTIROMO: Yes.

Do you really believe J.P. Morgan's going to be in charge of J.P. Morgan China?

DIMON: Yes.

BARTIROMO: You do?

DIMON: I do.

BARTIROMO: You think you're going to be able to make money and take it out of China?

(CROSSTALK)

DIMON: And data-sharing is a real issue, but we do not share our data with the Chinese government.

And, again, this gets -- becomes very complex, because every country now, every country is talking about whose data sits where and stuff like that. So, we -- and so we're going to be very careful.

Now, we're at the forefront of protecting the privacy of our people, the privacy of data, et cetera. And I think dividends will be the regular way.

BARTIROMO: You think any contract you sign will be backed by a rule of law in China?

DIMON: We are -- in every country, when we sign a contract, different rules apply. We know what the rules are in China.

That does not mean I like them. We just sign with our eyes open.

I mean, a lot of these things...

BARTIROMO: All right, let me move on.

DIMON: Yes. Yes.

BARTIROMO: Yes.

The national security issue, I think, is real. And when I said you're Jamie Dimon, I meant I know you for a long time. You're not in it just for the money. Or is it just about the money?

DIMON: No, of course not.

I'm a patriot way before I worry about any money or anything like that or about J.P. Morgan, per se. But we -- you should imagine that foreign policy of the United States is set by the government of the United States.

If you start telling companies that they should be setting their own foreign policy, you're actually making a huge error for the United States.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BARTIROMO: My thanks to chairman and CEO of J.P. Morgan Jamie Dimon.

Coming up, former Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe on corporate America and communist China, as former Trump Deputy NSA Adviser Mr. Pottinger testifies on the current agenda of the CCP.

Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATTHEW POTTINGER, FORMER U.S. DEPUTY NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: Beijing has stolen sensitive data sufficient to build a dossier on every single American adult and on many of our children too, who are fair game under Beijing's rules of political warfare.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BARTIROMO: Welcome back.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN DONAHOE, CEO, NIKE: China is a very important market for us. We have a long-term history in China.

We take a very long-term view in China. We're continuing to invest in China. And we will continue to invest in China, while also operating a very responsible global supply chain.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BARTIROMO: Yes, responsible.

That was the CEO of Nike all in on doing business in China, despite the very significant national security threats and human rights abuses.

Joining me right now to discuss the Communist Party and corporate America, the man who told us months ago that COVID-19 likely escaped from the Wuhan lab and China is covering it up, former Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe.

John, it's great to see you. Thanks very much.

JOHN RATCLIFFE, FORMER U.S. DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE: Great to be with you, Maria.

BARTIROMO: I believe, during the 100th year anniversary speech, Xi Jinping discussed corporate America as a way in to America in some ways.

They're already on the inside of this country. Your reaction to what you have heard this morning.

RATCLIFFE: Yes, no better example than your interview with Jamie Dimon.

As I listened to Mr. Dimon, I was struck by the fact that very little of what he said is consistent with U.S. intelligence on China or consistent with China's actions in the global marketplace. He kept calling them a strategic competitor.

They're not. They're an unlawful, dishonest competitor in the world marketplace. But, more importantly, they're our number one adversary, our top national security threat. They want to supplant us as the world's superpower. And, most importantly, they want to subjugate us to communist rules in order in the world marketplace.

And, quite frankly, Maria, it is those Wall Street investment banks that have been the biggest perpetrators of this false narrative of China as some noble strategic competitor. And they do so because those investment banks are selling trillions, not billions, but trillions of dollars in debt and equities in Chinese companies to U.S. investors and retirees.

They're literally banking on the success of China and the Chinese Communist Party over U.S. national security interests.

So, I was really troubled by what Mr. Dimon said. And he -- three times, he said, we shouldn't get -- China acts like any other country in the world, and we shouldn't get breathless over them.

That's just simply not true. There is no country who has done more to damage the world economy or the citizens of the world over the past few years than China.

BARTIROMO: Yes.

RATCLIFFE: China, and China alone, is responsible for millions and millions of deaths from COVID-19 and the actions that they took to cover it up.

So, it's about time that we have an honest discussion about who China is, and not allow these false narratives to be perpetrated.

BARTIROMO: Chinese firms have raised about $76 billion through IPOs in the U.S. in the past decade.

You have got China Telecom now wanting to raise even more, China Telecom just this past week talking about raising $7.3 billion in the top listing of 2021, John.

And here is how Roger Robinson explained it to me, Roger Robinson Jr., when he joined me on FOX Business last week: "The greatest financial scandal in world history, the multitrillion-dollar underwriting by a democracy of a totalitarian police state bent on its utter destruction, courtesy of greed- driven Wall Street firms and corrupt government regulators at the Treasury and the SEC."

Where is Biden's government? Where is Biden's administration here, John? Why is it that they are telling us that the Chinese companies can still avoid answering U.S. audits? I mean, they don't even have to report their true earnings.

And, of course, they're being subsidized by the CCP, and investors are just buying it, as if the numbers are real. And they don't even follow Sarbanes- Oxley...

RATCLIFFE: Right. Well, the reason for...

BARTIROMO: ... the way other -- every other company does.

RATCLIFFE: The reason for that is, Maria, as you have outlined, there are financial and economic reasons, and there's also political reasons that folks don't want China to be the bad guy. They don't want it to be the villain.

They want to put the number of $1.4 billion Chinese and the profits that can be made there over the interests of a number like $600,000, which is the number of American deaths, and counting, from China's treachery and their actions to cover up COVID-19 and its origins.

And so the Biden administration and I think, frankly, administrations of all Western democracy policies should approach policy decisions with regard to accountability for the great tragedy caused by China.

And restitution for economic losses and for loss of life should be part of foreign policy by Western governments with regard to China going forward. That's the only way we hold China accountable, instead of complaining about it, countering it.

And the Biden administration has a wonderful opportunity to lead on this. I doubt they will have the courage to do so.

BARTIROMO: Well, I mean, look, I mentioned China Telecom. They raised money in Hong Kong, because now the CCP sees Hong Kong as the only place its companies can raise money.

I mean, just the crackdown in Hong Kong alone should have been enough for the G7 countries to say, we can't accept this, the CCP coming in 20 years too soon and getting the goose-step police in there and throwing freedom fighters in jail. Global companies are now looking to exits out of Hong Kong.

Jamie Dimon told me as well his operation was impacted by the crackdown.

RATCLIFFE: Yes, but you highlighted -- you led in with a clip from Nike's CEO, who is saying, we are of and for China. And they're investing heavily in China.

I mean, it shows the hypocrisy of corporate interests in this country. I mean, China is supporting -- the Chinese -- or Nike is supporting the Chinese Communist Party with their policies. They're a company that criticizes U.S. policy, but they won't step out on China.

And, unfortunately, again, you have companies putting profits over national security interests. And it's time for the Biden administration to be clear- eyed and take decisive action in terms of countering all of the terrible things that China has done that are really -- they're not debatable.

BARTIROMO: Yes, well, which is why we constantly mention all of the conflicts of interest in the Biden family and how much money Hunter Biden made in China, because you have to ask a question, yourself, whether or not this is because of the conflicts of interest.

But, look, I want to move on. I want to move on to more shocking news at the Southern border this week. You have got COVID coming in, illicit drugs coming in. And Joe Biden continues to ignore the severity of this, and instead take shots at governors from red states, like Texas and Florida.

Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Just two states, Florida and Texas, account for one-third of all new COVID-19 cases in the entire country.

I say to these governors, please help. But if you aren't going to help, at least get out of the way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BARTIROMO: Get out of the way.

John, your reaction?

RATCLIFFE: Well, it's infuriating. It's nonsensical. But the bottom line is, it's just total garbage.

I mean, I came on your program in January and talked about the fact that, if Joe Biden reversed the policies at our border, he would create a humanitarian crisis that didn't exist. That's exactly what happened.

And you and I -- and you have documented that well on this program, Maria. But what neither one of us saw was that he would take a humanitarian crisis and now create a health -- public health crisis at our border as well. By his actions, he's created the largest COVID super-spreader event anywhere on the planet at the Southern border in Texas right now.

And to criticize Texas over COVID is just -- is just nonsensical. I mean, let me put this in perspective for you, Maria. As you and I, as U.S. citizens, if we go to Mexico City, and we want to return to our home country, we can't do so, the Biden administration says we can't do so without a COVID-negative test.

At the very same time, the Biden administration is allowing thousands of COVID-infected illegal aliens not only into the country, but then transporting them around the country, and, again, in what has been the largest super-spreader COVID event anywhere in the world.

And the Biden administration is directly responsible for that.

BARTIROMO: And yet Joe Biden made believe he didn't know who Ron DeSantis is last week. Ron DeSantis pushed back, saying, what else doesn't he remember?

There's that other elephant in the room, in terms of cognitive difficulties from the leader of the free world. What does that tell our adversaries across the world?

RATCLIFFE: Well, I mean, I hate to criticize Joe Biden. It almost seems like elder abuse to talk about those things.

But the bottom line is, whether or not he's making decisions or not, he's accountable for the decisions of his administration. And both domestically and from a foreign policy standpoint, they have been a disaster. And the American people, I'm confident, will hold him accountable at the upcoming elections, both at the midterm and in 2024.

And, frankly, I think that will be important to do to save America.

BARTIROMO: Well, they're trying to save Kamala Harris' brand right now with these emergency meetings. She will be next up.

RATCLIFFE: Good luck.

BARTIROMO: We will be watching that.

John Ratcliffe, it's good to see you. Thanks very much.

RATCLIFFE: Thank you.

BARTIROMO: Candace Owens is here. She's up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BARTIROMO: Welcome back.

We have been discussing the Democrats' weaponization of policies and race. And it is threatening our democracy.

Joining me right now to weigh in is Candace Owens. She is the host of "Candace."

And, Candace, it is always wonderful to see you. Thanks very much for being here.

Do you see any reasons to be hopeful? Walk us through how you assess things today.

CANDACE OWENS, HOST, "CANDACE": Maria, I speak all over the country. And I wouldn't do that if I was not optimistic.

I'm incredibly optimistic, because it's very apparent that the left is losing control of the narrative. If they weren't losing control the narrative, it wouldn't be necessary to censor so many conservatives. It wouldn't have been necessary to censor the then sitting president of United States President Donald Trump.

You wouldn't see these efforts at propaganda, these calls to pull people like me off of the Internet because our following is bigger than entire networks like CNN. And so they're fearful because they realize that people are waking up to the truth, especially when it comes to black America, right?

So, despite all of their rhetoric, think about this. If you're feeling low about things, despite all of their rhetoric castigating Donald Trump, calling him a racist, a white supremacist for four years straight, calling all of his supporters racists and white supremacists, President Donald Trump increased black voters and Hispanic voters for the Republican Party.

Why is that possible? Because black Americans and Latino Americans are no longer falling for the rhetoric. And they know this. This is why they're going through extremes. This is why they are fighting tooth and nail to make sure that mail-in ballots becomes the norm in terms of how we vote in this country. This is why they want to keep this existential crisis of a pandemic going on for as long as possible.

So, yes, every single day, I wake up and I am hopeful, because what they look like to me are incredibly desperate individuals.

BARTIROMO: Yes, but, I mean, how do you stop this, Candace?

I mean, look, if we're talking about more lockdowns in the summer and fall of 2022, that's exactly where this is going. Mail-in ballots are the standard, mail-in ballots from empty parking lots and dead people.

OWENS: Yes, that's right.

BARTIROMO: I mean, look, Nancy Pelosi said yesterday she's confident the Democrats are going to keep the majority.

OWENS: Yes, I mean, she says that every single time. And I don't think she should be confident.

And let me tell you what's so special about this country, when weighed against all of the other countries who are fighting right now for their rights. We know there are protests every day in the U.K., there are protests in France, there are protests in Germany demanding an end to these lockdowns, because people are -- reality is catching up with the narrative, right?

People are realizing, they're telling you to be fearful, but they don't feel fearful. They're realizing that it's the media that keeps telling them they're all going to die every single day. And yet they wake up, and that just doesn't seem to be the reality. And people are standing up.

What makes America unique is that we have state rights, right? The federal government can't come in and say, you know what, it doesn't matter. We're going to take things over. And that is why they are fighting people like Governor DeSantis. It's why they are fighting Governor Abbott.

It is because they are realizing that America is unique and that we -- the federal government is not going to have this overreach.

BARTIROMO: Ah, but they want to take away rights from the states. They're doing it even in the infrastructure package.

Candace, stay right there. More to come with you.

We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: Not even during the Civil War did insurrectionists breach the Capitol of the United States of America, the citadel of our democracy, not even then.

But, on January the 6th, 2021, they did.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BARTIROMO: We're back with Candace Owens. She is host of "Candace."

That was President Biden on Thursday once again evoking race to push his radical agenda, suggesting that the January 6 Capitol attack was worse than the Civil War, which resulted in the deaths of 750,000 soldiers.

Candace, your thoughts on this rhetoric?

OWENS: What I love about this rhetoric is that, as a D.C. resident who was living there on January 6 -- I mean, I was nine months pregnant. I wasn't there, but a couple of blocks down.

It's just hilarious following what was essentially an entire summer of Black Lives Matter burning down our city. You want to talk about people that were taking down, trying to take down federal statues, and they want me to be fearful about grandmas taking selfies.

And the reason for this is because Democrats again have lost the plot. And they know this. This rhetoric isn't working on anybody. Nobody believes that January 6 was worse than the Civil War. It's -- he doesn't even believe it when he says it.

And this is all they have left, is rhetoric, because they're realizing that they are losing grip with the regular Americans. And that is the truth. Joe Biden has no idea what he is talking about. He is saying exactly what his handlers tell him to say.

What they're trying to do is criminalize conservatives coming together to fight during times when their rights are being threatened. And that is what we must stand up to.

Do not be afraid, if you are conservative, to come together to host rallies, to host events. Do not be afraid because you're fearful that the FBI is going to try to criminalize you coming together. This is really just more totalitarian talk from Joe Biden, trying to criminalize half the nation for supporting Donald Trump, who should be in office, instead of him.

BARTIROMO: Yes.

Well, it does appear that they can't win on policy. Look at this massive spending. They're going to get the New Green Deal through because Republicans are voting for infrastructure right now.

Do you trust that we will have a fair and free election in 2022 and 2024?

OWENS: I don't think we will in states like California. No, I think it's too polluted.

I am hopeful that the states are -- state legislators are doing their job to fight tooth and nail. And it seems that they are, which is why people like Michelle Obama are increasing their rhetoric, saying, we have to make sure Republicans can't clean up elections.

So, yes, I am hopeful that on, a state-by-state level, people are realizing what happened in this last election, that they used an existential crisis to push through policies that they wanted pushed through.

And, yes, we have to remain hopeful. If we don't have hope, we have nothing.

BARTIROMO: All right, Candace, it's great to see you this morning. Thanks very much, Candace Owens joining us.

Love talking with you, as always.

That will do it for us. Have a great Sunday, everybody.

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