'Special Report' All-Star Panel on Russia-Ukraine tensions

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Biden threatens Putin with sanctions if he invades Ukraine

'Special Report' panel weighs in on Russia-Ukraine tensions

This is a rush transcript of "Special Report with Bret Baier" on December 7, 2021. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

BAIER: President Biden with a two-hour virtual discussion, meeting with the Russian leader Vladimir Putin over the digital communication. The White House says the message was sent that the U.S. is not going to put up with Russia invading Ukraine. But what comes from that, what is going to happen?

Let's bring in our panel, Mara Liasson, national political correspondent of National Public Radio, Guy Benson, political editor at Townhall.com, host of "The Guy Benson Show" on FOX News Radio, and former Education Secretary Bill Bennett. Bill, your thoughts.

BILL BENNETT, FORMER EDUCATION SECRETARY: First, that was a very moving piece on Pearl Harbor, one you talked about the generation defining moment. One person who helped define that generation, Bob Dole. I just want to take this opportunity to say he was a friend, and we will miss him. Thank you for letting me do that.

Well, eye to eye, National Security Adviser Sullivan said, but we shall see what happens. Afghanistan was not a great moment. I'm sure that it had something do with Russia's actions here. I'd be more impressed if we were arming, sufficiently arming the Ukrainians now. Why not javelin missiles? All I heard about was defensive missiles. What about some offensive missiles? Take some toll on the Russians, be ready to take some toll on the Russians should they invade.

And the Nord Stream 2 pipeline, really, do we really think we can impose upon the Germans the willingness to give up that pipeline, having signed off on it? I wish we had more options short of what we have got. But the main thing we don't have is, I think, resoluteness in the Oval Office. That's what bothers me.

BAIER: have you mentioned the Nord Stream 2 pipeline. Take a listen, using that as leverage. They talked about that today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAKE SULLIVAN, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISOR: Gas is not currently flowing through the Nord Stream 2 pipeline, which means that it's not operating, which means that it's not leverage for Putin.

REP. MIKE WALTZ, (R-FL): What Putin knows in the middle of winter is he will be able to starve Ukraine and starve eastern Europe, and he will be able to hold Germany hostage with their energy supply.

Putin knows he can withstand U.N. sanctions if he has a fractured Europe, and Nord Stream 2 is exactly what's going to fracture Europe.

BAIER: Mara, your thoughts?

MARA LIASSON, NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, NATIONAL PUBLIC RADIO: Nord stream 2 has been a real problem not just for President Biden. President Trump wanted Germany to cancel that. He failed to get that done. But Germany is making some kind of positive noises that they will consider doing something about that if Russia invades Ukraine.

I think the big question from today is when Jake Sullivan says he looked Putin in the eye and says we are going to do things that we didn't do in 2014, what does that mean? Does that mean canceling Russia's access to the international banking system through a program called SWIFT? Does it mean that that would in effect freeze the bank accounts of oligarchs and President Putin? That would be something that would probably hurt. But if they just do the kind of sanctions that they did in 2014, we know that didn't deter Putin from annexing Crimea. So we have to see what the U.S. and its European allies come up with that would really make a difference to Russia.

BAIER: Guy?

GUY BENSON, POLITICAL EDITOR, TOWNHALL.COM: Yes, I agree with Mara, this is a moment of testing not just for President Biden but for the rest broadly. Bill is right that American weakness is provocative, and what we are hearing from the White House and from some of our allies is that this time will be different. And Mara was noting 2014, the annexation of Crimea. Don't forget 2008 and the incursion into Georgia. Putin has attempted very provocative things, and, in fact, pulled them off multiple times in recent memory. And there was an explosion in each case of sound and fury and finger wagging, and a few things happened, and Putin seems to have absorbed them. Would this time be different? Would it be painful enough? Are those threats credible and painful enough to actually deter Putin from doing something that he appears to be preparing to do? We'll see.

BAIER: All right, let's turn domestically now to crime, and it is on the rise around the country. We have seen different cities with significant increases, especially when it comes to robberies and armed robberies. Bill, this is a big problem. And these cities are dealing with it differently.

BENNETT: Yes. When I was secretary of education, we looked at schools that failed, and we wondered what to do. We said let's take a look at schools that work and what practices they were engaged in. Let's look at cities that work. And I think you will find that people are arrested. They stay arrested. The prosecutors prosecute. They go to jail, and they stay there for a long time, not this quick in and out.

Also, I think the bail reform system, bail system needs to be reformed. Use the federal model. Don't make it dependent on cash and on whether people are poor or rich. Make it dependent on danger to the committee. Likelihood of that person committing another crime. And if that likelihood is there, keep them in jail. Look at the places that work, you will find this is what they are doing along these lines.

BAIER: Mara, the repeat offenders, that's part of the criticism is some of these prosecutors are just not prosecuting or putting people back out on the street.

LIASSON: Yes. Look, bail reform is important. Bill just talked about it. You don't want to penalize people because they're poor. You don't want to have debtors' prison where states or municipalities are basically dependent on cash bail to fund their budgets. But, for violent crime, yes, people want those criminals off the street and in prison.

And one other weird little wrinkle of this, this smash and grab kind of looting, is because it's so easy to sell that stuff on the Internet now. That's what's motivating a lot of this.

BAIER: Guy, last word.

BENSON: I would say as a political proposition, the Republicans are hitting on these issues every single day. They intend to make public safety a big issue in 22.

BAIER: Yes, indeed. All right, panel, thank you so much.

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