Michigan protest organizer: Governor has mocked state's workers

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Michigan protest organizer: Governor has mocked state's workers

Michigan Conservative Coalition co-founder Meshawn Maddock speaks out about 'Operation Gridlock.'

This is a rush transcript from "Your World with Neil Cavuto," April 15, 2020. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

NEIL CAVUTO, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: All right, Bill, thank you very, very much.

We're following developments very, very closely in Lansing, Michigan, to the left of your screen. We will be hearing from the Governor, Gretchen Whitmer, right now. Her even tougher stay-at-home policies now have invited this wrath that Grady Trimble just talked to Bill Hemmer about, where there's a traffic jam of people saying, we understand stay at home, but this is beyond crazy.

The governor taking a number of stringent measures to demand that residents quit moving between homes, quit crossing the street to go to other friends. Don't use motorboats, use a canoe. It got to be so surreal for these people that, whether you're on the left or the right, a lot of people felt the governor overextended herself.

Let's listen to how she's responding to this criticism right now, Governor Whitmer now talking to her state.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

GOV. GRETCHEN WHITMER (D-MI): And they're on the front lines every single day helping us get through this crisis.

Every time I speak to them, I feel the impact this virus has had on them and their families. A staff member of mine has a family member who is a nurse. And at the end of his long shifts, he will often stay in the garage and cry before going into the house.

Another friend of mine has multiple sclerosis and a compromised immune system. She has been in her apartment for five weeks. We have all missed birthdays and celebrations, whether they were weddings or holidays, with our family and friends. Incredible sacrifice has been made by the people of Michigan.

And it's really paying off. These are hard times, but we are getting to get through this together. I know that there are many who are struggling with their mental health right now. People are lonely and isolated and frustrated and would give anything to return back to normal.

And I have to tell you, I would too. We're going to get there. It's going to take some time. It won't all happen overnight, but we will get there, if we are smart, we do what we need to do and everyone plays their part.

We have to mitigate risk. And so while we will be reunited with our friends and loved ones again, it's important that we continue to double down on our efforts today.

For those of you who held your Easter brunch or your Passover, your Seder dinner over Zoom, instead of being in person, thank you for doing your part.

For every teacher who's instructing your students online, thank you for doing your part. For every grocery store clerk who is working incredibly long hours, so that special hours can be available for our older Michiganders, thank you for going above and beyond and doing your part.

And for every health care provider who's putting their own lines -- their own lives on the line to save others, thank you for doing your part.

This is a hard time, but the good news is that the vast majority of people in our state are doing the right thing. And it's pushing the curve down. It's working, saving lives.

Yesterday, I went to Novi to inspect Suburban Showplace alternate care site. I want to thank the owners of Suburban. I want to thank Ascension Health System. I want to thank the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers, the Army Corps, the National Guard, the Department of Health and Human Services and FEMA.

Something remarkable happened while we were there. And the head of Region 5, our person that we work with so often from FEMA, acknowledged that the build-out of Suburban Showplace, which was originally slated to be a 1,000- bed facility, is now a 250-bed facility.

We will have the capacity to increase that if it's necessary. But because of this stay-home order, it might not be, and so we're only building it out for 250 at this time.

He also showed me his phone, a text from someone in another state asking how they can replicate what is happening here in Michigan. People are taking notice. We're working incredibly hard and well with our partners at the federal level.

So today's update with regard to the number of positive cases that have been reported is 28,095. In those numbers are also 1,921 deaths.

We must continue to stay home whenever we can, so we can protect our families.

Yesterday, the president met with a number of people who have recovered from COVID-19. One of them was a man from Northern Michigan, Mark Campbell, who was telling the president how he believes he caught the virus. He was explaining that he and his family decided to go up north and go skiing, which seemed like a safe activity, because very few people were traveling or going north, and no one was around.

He told the president -- quote -- "The only thing I can think of that was out of the ordinary is that I touched a gasoline pump handle."

I share that story because what we know is that COVID-19 can live on a stainless steel surface for 72 hours. Think about how many people touch a gas pump handle in the span of three days. And that's why we don't want anyone on the road who doesn't have to be there.

A couple of weeks ago -- I'm going to give you an update on PPE now.

A couple of weeks ago, we had less than a day's worth of PPE in Southeast Michigan hospitals. We were working day to day. Since then, Michiganders and businesses have stepped up to donate...

CAVUTO: All right, we are monitoring very, very closely Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer. She is outlining the continuation of pretty stringent stay-at-home plans that she really locked down yesterday, no play on words there, to make them even tougher for residents in the state now, who cannot journey between homes, if they have vacation homes or what have you, in the state, also can't use motorboats.

You can't buy plants or garden supplies at stores. You cannot go crossing the street and see the neighbors or friends in the middle of the day without some oversight here.

But it's the kind of stuff that has sent alarming protests across the state, saying, she went too far. They understand distancing rules and sheltering provisions, but she has gone way, way, way too far.

We're monitoring whether she is going to lift or ease up on some of that, given the outcry she's gotten from residents in her state.

But this next guest is leading the effort to say, dial it back, dial it way back.

Meshawn Maddock is the Michigan Conservative Coalition, co-founder, Operation Gridlock organizer.

Meshawn, thank you for taking the time.

MESHAWN MADDOCK, MICHIGAN CONSERVATIVE UNION: Oh, my gosh. Thank you.

CAVUTO: It doesn't appear that -- we wanted to stay with that conference a little longer, and it doesn't appear she is retreating on this. So what do you think?

MADDOCK: Well, I don't know. I think that tone, that's the first I have heard it. I was just listening in.

I can tell you what. That is probably the most -- that is the nicest tone that she has had so far. She's been downright mocking. I mean, her last press conference -- last press conference two days ago, I heard responses from people saying that it feels -- I felt like she was mocking the Michigan workers and mocking the Michiganders for things that they have had taken from them.

I mean, right now in Michigan bureaucrats have shut down our industry. And today was a perfect example of people in Michigan rising up and trying to put a voice. And the only way we could put a voice was by putting people safely in their cars and driving to the capitol.

And I hope to God that she heard that message loud and clear, because it's time to get workers back to work in Michigan safely.

CAVUTO: You know, Meshawn, in doing that -- and I understand your rage and a lot of their rage.

But the fact of the matter is, a lot of those protesters, by converging on Lansing, and where else it's going on, violated distancing policies already in place, and might have endangered their health and other people's health.

Your thoughts?

MADDOCK: You know what? That's kind of a spin. We have heard it.

I was there. I was there from 9:00 in the morning on. We had over 10,000 vehicles, the Michigan Police Department let us know. Michigan State Police reported 10,000 vehicles. I was there locked in traffic every single road trying to get into Lansing, cars, trucks.

Half of them were workers' vehicles with their small businesses and workers representing their businesses. Those people never left their vehicles. There was a small group of people with some other counterprotests, somewhere around 200. Those are the numbers from the Michigan State Police that were gathered on the lawn.

We yelled at them to get back in their cars. I had to step out to do a few interviews. And I gently yelled at all of them, please get back in your cars. But we don't really have any control over that. They're exercising their First Amendment right.

And I hope they knew what they were doing. It was very cold outside, so they weren't out there for as long. I can tell you, almost all of the people got into their cars with the people that they have been sheltering with, packed a snack, drove to Lansing to show their protest.

The most fun that they had within the last 48 hours making signs. I can't even tell you what some of these signs were. And it -- I have to admit, it felt a little fun for a few minutes, because it's been so depressing. Michigan has been just under tyranny.

We had to lay off seven employees of our own. But I got emotional, Neil. When I walked through the line, getting back to my vehicle, I went Facebook Live. And when you look into these cars, and you see a bookstore, you see a coffee shop owner, a small insurance agency owner, a paint store owner, landscapers, bricklayers, I mean, I could go on and on.

These are real people with real families and bills to pay. They have mortgages to pay. So they got to go to Lansing and kind of have a little parade.

CAVUTO: But, Meshawn, you did mention -- you did mention the paint makers and paint stores and garden supplies.

Do you know the good governor excluded purchases of those items to tighten this -- these stay-at-home provisions? I mean, she's the first governor to do anything quite like that.

The motorboat thing vs. the canoe thing, motorboats bad, canoes OK, it just seems like much more of a strict measure than was already in place. The governor has said it's to address the fact that Michigan has suddenly shot up to the state with the third highest number of cases and now accelerating that way in deaths.

But it does raise questions as to why these particular measures.

MADDOCK: It doesn't make any sense.

Your guess is as good as ours. That's really why this came about. The only thing that I can tell you is, it feels like shameless self-promotion. I mean, how much attention has she gotten from this? How much attention does she continue to draw?

The day after she got out in Michigan and mocked us by taking away many of our liberties and hobbies and jobs, and putting workers out of work, she had some T-shirt company make a T-shirt with the name that the president gave her, and she went on late-night television.

I mean, you tell me how that feels to the workers in Michigan and the people struggling to make ends meet, not to mention the fact that our unemployment system in Michigan is completely archaic and can't service the unemployment.

My husband is the state representative. All he is doing is feeling -- fielding phone calls of people trying to get their unemployment checks, and that system is gone. So, we have no answer for why she's doing what she's doing.

CAVUTO: All right.

MADDOCK: She is -- imagine this, Neil. She is a governor who is keeping abortion clinics open, but she bans the sale of the American flag. I mean, to me, that pretty much sums her up.

CAVUTO: All right. I don't know if I can verify that.

But, Meshawn, I do want to thank you for taking the time.

Following this very, very closely, Meshawn Maddock leading this campaign against what the governor is trying to do.

We did put out a call to Governor Whitmer to talk to us about this. We have not heard anything back.

But, again, nerves are frayed on both ends, as these lockdown measures continue, not only in states like Michigan, but across the country, but particularly frayed nerves in Michigan right now, where many are saying the governor might have overdone it.

But if this telegraphs any unwinding of those provisions by the end of the month, when a lot of states might be considering doing just that, it doesn't look like it's the case in Michigan.

Having said that, and when we come back, a number of states are toying with the idea of gradually -- and they mean gradually -- and in staggering fashion, getting back to something approaching business, not as usual, but business that right now would be very unusual, if they get back to anything approaching it.

This on the same day we have heard that Germany will get back to business as usual, lifting lockdown provisions or kind of lockdown provisions that have been in effect now for the better part of three weeks come next week.

Schools will be back in service on May 3 as well in Germany, but that's Germany. So far, that is not the United States.

We're on top of it all. Stay with us. You're watching "Your World."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAVUTO: Well, the president certainly been talking to a lot of CEOs and the rest.

He and the vice president is part of this new council that's going to advise the president on when exactly, how to reopen America, essentially.

He was getting some thoughts from Jeff Bezos, from Mark Zuckerberg, and a host of others. In fact, when I was looking at some of the names here, from Steve Forbes, to Tim Cook, Condoleezza Rice, Jamie Dimon, it's a who's-who in the business, technology, political worlds.

But, again, the boldfaced names Zuckerberg and Jeff Bezos of Amazon certainly stand out. It doesn't end here, by the way. There are many more powers, on the phone, virtual and otherwise, that are going to continue as the week ensues.

John Roberts at the White House with the very latest.

Hey, John.

JOHN ROBERTS, FOX NEWS CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Neil, good afternoon to you.

The president literally burning up the phone since first thing this morning talking to members of his new Great American Economic Revival Industry Groups.

The president today with a number of different phone calls and dozens of people on the line taking on banking, financial services, food and beverage, hospitality and retail industry groups, health care, tech, telecommunications, and transportation industry groups, agriculture, construction, labor, work force, defense, energy, and manufacturing industry groups, as well as thought leaders and people in the sports industry.

And I believe he's still on that call with the sports industry right now. The president yesterday naming 220 people who he will reach out to for advice on how, when and where to reopen the country. Here's what the president said about the group.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: They're the names that are, I think, the best and the smartest, the brightest. And they're going to give us some ideas.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERTS: The president spoke today with the National Retail Federation earlier.

Here's what the National Retail Federation said. About that.

They said that they appreciated being invited to participate, and also said: "When the health conditions are right for reopening, our members will be ready to provide service customers with effective safeguards and protocols in place."

We don't know if the call is still going on, but the president began the call at about 3:30 with people in the sports industry. This would be commissioners and team owners. Commissioner Roger Goodell of the NFL was on there. The head of the PGA was on there.

And so was the owner of the Dallas Mavericks, Mark Cuban. We spoke with him earlier today on FOX News. Here's what he said about the potential for reopening the country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARK CUBAN, OWNER, DALLAS MAVERICKS: This is such a moving target that I think the biggest mistake we can make is rush to a decision, but I'm going to help him in every way I can, whatever he needs me to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERTS: Tomorrow, the president will speak with all 50 of the nation's governors about what their thinking is about potentially reopening.

Obviously, Neil, some areas of the country will be able to open before others. The president said yesterday there's probably 20 states that will be ready to go on or even before May the 1st.

But another problem cropping up as well, sources telling FOX News that the fund, that $350 billion for the Small Business association paycheck protection loans, they thought that they were going to hit the cap today. It looks like they're going to hit that cap tomorrow. And there is no plan in Congress yet to replenish that fund -- Neil.

CAVUTO: All right, John Roberts, thank you very much.

They're looking for that extra $250 billion. Good luck.

All right, in the meantime here, there is this balance between business, commerce, if you will, and the medical urgent needs here, and to balance life and death with, well, our economy.

Bernie Marcus, Home Depot co-founder, was telling me earlier on FOX Business that it's a balance we have to address, and fast.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BERNIE MARCUS, CO-FOUNDER, HOME DEPOT: If we're going to wait to the last person has coronavirus before we open this country up, there will be nothing to open it up to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAVUTO: All right, Dr. Kevin Campbell is with us now, chief medical officer, also a cardiologist, North Ridge Executive Wellness, much, much more.

Very good, Doctor, having you.

It is a tough balance. What would you like to see, Doctor, to slowly unwind some of these sheltering provisions that have been in effect now essentially all this month?

DR. KEVIN CAMPBELL, CHIEF MEDICAL OFFICER, PACEMATE: You know, first of all, it's not one size fits all.

We have to take special care and look at places like New York vs. rural Iowa. We have to use a county-by-county, state-by-state approach to determine where it's safe to open the economy.

And I think we need to get started right away with opening the places that are safe and delaying that opening in places that are hot spots.

CAVUTO: But what about, Doctor, those who are vulnerable?

You're a cardiologist, much more. They're in a vulnerable group themselves, those with heart conditions, those with any respiratory issues, diabetes, those with any serious neurological disease, what have you.

How do you advise them? No matter what the blanket orders or recommendations are, would that, should that group stay home for a while? What do you think?

CAMPBELL: I agree with you 100 percent.

I think you have to look at your own risk and the risk of your community. If you're over 65, if you have a heart condition, if you have asthma or respiratory disease, if you have diabetes, cancer or have anything that suppresses your immune system, I think you should stay at home until this entire thing is over.

The risk isn't worth it, because we know these patients do much worse when they get the COVID virus. However, if you're the average person in a community that has very few cases, I think we should start opening restaurants and moving forward.

CAVUTO: All right, Dr. Campbell, thank you.

I apologize, all the breaking news and truncating this, but I do very much appreciate your efforts on behalf of all of us, Doctor. It's certainly meaningful.

All right, we have a lot more coming up, including what Wall Street took in today, a lot of awful economic news.

Now, they knew it was going to be awful. I guess they didn't know it was going to be this awful. But all was said and done, a sell-off that looked severe was actually much better than it had been.

We will spell it all out -- after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)  CAVUTO: All right, we just heard from John Roberts that that small business package has met such demand that the money might run out for it sometime tomorrow.

There's a $250 billion measure in the works to add to that, but it's kind of in limbo here.

Senator Jeanne Shaheen of New Hampshire, the Democratic senator, joining us right now.

Senator, you were not a fan, I believe, of the last stimulus package in the aggregate, the $2.2-$2.3 trillion one. So I imagine you would not be for the $250 billion in extra funding they're looking for, the small business part?

SEN. JEANNE SHAHEEN (D-NH): Actually, I was a big fan.

I was, along with Senators Rubio, Cardin, and Collins, one of the four people who negotiated that Paycheck Protection Program and worked very hard to see that it got into the CARES relief package.

I do think we need more money. As you pointed out, we have already approved -- the SBA has already approved 1.1 million loans, over that, probably -- that was last night -- to the tune of about $280 billion.

So, there's been a huge demand. We have seen a lot of our businesses in New Hampshire who have been approved for loans. We need to see that money flowing.

And we need to address some of the challenges that have come up with the program. This has been a huge effort. It's bigger than anything the SBA has ever tried to do. So, it's understandable that there would be some glitches. We need to fix those for the next round.

We need to make sure that loans are going to the mom-and-pop shops, the small retail stores that are so important to New Hampshire's rural communities, and make sure that they can get in the queue and get approved.

CAVUTO: Do you worry, as some in your party have, Senator -- and not exclusively your party -- that a lot of this aid might be tilted toward bigger businesses, and that's a concern? Or is it?

SHAHEEN: Well, I think there is concern with minority communities, with low-income communities, with small businesses that may not have a bank that they work with regularly, because, as we understand, lenders are going to go to their customers that they know first.

But there was an approval for a number of fintech companies, for Square, for PayPal, for Intuit, to participate.

CAVUTO: Right.

SHAHEEN: And they have a lot of those customers.

So, that's very important, as we think about what we do going forward.

CAVUTO: All right, Senator Shaheen, thank you very much.

I apologize for our truncated time, because I'm going to do the same to your counterpart, a Republican senator who joins me right now.

It's interesting, looking at all of this, Senator Kevin Cramer of North Dakota, because, to the senator's point, Senator Shaheen's point, there is support for more help for small business.

But it's -- the devil is going to be in the details of getting this $250 billion through, if Congress can't quickly come together and meet.

You can't do it virtually, right?

SEN. KEVIN CRAMER (R-ND): No, that's correct, Neil.

And one of the things that's happening, of course, is, you find Secretary Mnuchin, who was integral in negotiating this entire CARES package, especially this portion of the Paycheck Protection Program and the other economic parts of it.

But one thing we know for sure is that the $350 billion for paycheck protection isn't enough. It's a wildly popular program. Senator Shaheen is exactly right. She was an important part of negotiating that, which is why it's the first chapter of the 880-page bill.

And it's also why it's running out of money so quickly. So, we know that it works. We know it's in high demand.

And I think we ought to put another $250 billion in it immediately, which we can do with a simple voice vote. And the details, as you speak of, are things that we ought to try to work on. But it's kind of difficult to do that when we're not all together.

CAVUTO: I don't know what the rules are of the Senate.

And Senator Shaheen was trying to remind folks that these provisions to protect particularly small businesses, and not big businesses, a concern she and I know you have had as well...

CRAMER: Right.

CAVUTO: ... that it might be stymied by rules that it's got to be unanimous, and if one person -- we certainly know one Congressman Massie on the House on the original stimulus -- stops that...

CRAMER: Right.

CAVUTO: ... people have to come in physically to Congress to do it, right?

CRAMER: No, that's exactly correct, Neil, which is why we ought to do the simplest thing that we can do, which is pass another -- appropriate another $250 billion without any strings attached.

Now, I'd love to see some changes. I shared Jeanne's concern for the mom- and-pops, as she called them, sole proprietorships, self-employed. It took an extra week to get the rules written for that particular part of the business community, which means that they lost out on the first week of the loans going out.

But -- but that's been corrected now. The rules are in place. Another $250 billion that is -- that is without bias, I think, would be the best way for our community banks to distribute this money.

But we can do that with a simple vote tomorrow.

CAVUTO: All right, Senator, thank you very much.

CRAMER: My pleasure.

CAVUTO: My apology to both you and Senator Shaheen for the relative short nature of this, given the breaking news, which, by the way, includes a lot of economic news.

We have retail sales, which were really, really awful, some index readings out of the New York metropolitan area and elsewhere that show the economy, as expected, didn't only stutter. It all but stopped in the latest month.

How to fix that -- after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)  CAVUTO: All right, well, the airlines got their aid, about $25 billion to $30 billion worth. So good news for United and American and Delta, who took the government up on it.

But it's not a gimme, it's not a grant. About 70 percent of that dough is a loan that has to be paid -- back after.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAVUTO: All right, ever since the closure of that Smithfield meat processing plant in South Dakota, a lot of people been asking, is our food supply safe, when so many of the workers there were sickened with the virus?

Did it put our meat in danger? Is the delay in opening that plant up, to say nothing of others, could that be a problem, certainly for shoppers who might be looking around and wondering where their pork is, where their beef is, where a lot of stuff is?

Brian Duncan is the Illinois Farm Bureau vice president. And he joins us right now.

Brian, how big an issue -- it started with this Smithfield plant, I guess. But it raised concerns about our meat supply, period. How does it stand in your eyes?  BRIAN DUNCAN, VICE PRESIDENT, ILLINOIS FARM BUREAU: Well, first of all, Neil, welcome back to the farm. Great to have you back with us again.

And I think it's obvious that some people would have some concerns about the availability of meat, seeing and reading about the plant closings. There's no need to be concerned about the safety.

I'm sure you're aware that the virus doesn't transmit through meat. But as we see the supply chain having difficulties in agriculture, it does raise questions of supply and availability.

There is no shortage of animals. There's no shortage of meat, but we do have a disruption in the supply chain, as we see workers either get sick or stay home for their own well-being. And we're certainly grateful for those that are working and keeping the food moving.

So it's a disruption. How long it lasts, I hope it's short for consumers, as well as the economic well-being of farmers.

CAVUTO: You know, Brian, when I was reporting earlier on FOX Business about this subject, one viewer passed along, well, I remember swine flu, and I wasn't going to touch bacon or anything like that for forever after that.

Now hearing this, people get afraid. Reassure them, if -- what you're saying, I have no doubt that you're accurate, but allay them of concerns that go beyond just the availability of meat or whether they can find it or whether the price goes up. What do you think?

DUNCAN: Sure.

The science is absolute on this, Neil. COVID doesn't transmit through me. So that science is unmistakable and absolute. And so consumers can rest assured that, when they buy that piece of meat at the grocery store and take it home to cook it, not only is it delicious and nutritious, Neil, but it's safe.

CAVUTO: So, Brian, when you look at where the country stands now -- and it's directly affected you. When American business stops, I mean, you guys still have a job to do. You're urgently in demand, vital personnel.

But I'm sure you want America to get back to work. I'm sure you want people back out of their homes, living their lives, or close to it.

So, when you hear this talk of looking at ways states and the president can coordinate opening up for business, what do you want to see?

DUNCAN: Well, I think you raise a great point, Neil.

What I want to see is a comprehensive plan that would allow parts of the country to open back up. Now, here in rural Illinois, the virus has -- there has been some cases, but it has been minor. And I am very much aware that there are parts of the country that have endured tremendous suffering for this -- through this crisis.

And, obviously, those places need some time to get back on their feet. But I think a strategy that could be spoken with some definitive timelines and some definitive measurables on when we could get things opened back up, get the retail sector back moving, the food service sector back moving, could provide some certainty for agriculture in these very difficult times on how to get the demand engine would get started again, at least in the food service and hospitality sector, would be very welcome.

CAVUTO: You know, Brian, when I had the pleasure of talking to you throughout the China trade imbroglios, and then -- and the crisis, and the issue was the Chinese making good on the commitments they ultimately made.

And now there's this dust-up we have with the World Health Organization and whether it was working in cahoots with China. We can get into the weeds on that one. I prefer not do.

I just wonder whether it's going to impact China making good on its commitments to buy more stuff from us, if it looks like things are getting dicey between us. What do you think?

DUNCAN: Well, I think that is a genuine worry out here. And I -- as you put this in context, this economic tsunami that's hit agriculture with the COVID virus, we were hoping to lean into some pretty good export sales to China with the signing of the phase one deal.

Will that happen? China, I know, has still been purchasing some pork. But what their needs are going to be going forward is in question as well. And, yes, you're right, Neil. The deterioration of that relationship sure could continue.

CAVUTO: All right.

Well, I wish you well, Brian. I mean, you have always had a stiff upper lip through one crisis after another, but God never throws anything at you that you can't handle. So you seem to be handling it. Good luck. Thank you very much.

DUNCAN: Well, someday, I'd like to have you come to the farm when we have got good news to report and show you around, Neil. But thank you for the opportunity.

CAVUTO: No, I'd love that, because I understand all your stuff is great and delicious.

(LAUGHTER)

CAVUTO: All right, but thank you very much, Brian.

All right, in the meantime here, we have got a lot going on. We have got the White House task force meeting today at 5:00 p.m. They might outline in about 20 minutes exactly where they are right now on this reopening of the United States you have heard so much about.

And then some incredible breakthroughs we have on COVID-19 testing, including a saliva test that is almost instantaneous and leaves out any threat or dangers for doctors and nurses administering it.

Fascinating -- after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAVUTO: All right, you don't like your tough stay-at-home measures, imagine what it's like in America right now, where the governor just doubled down and forbid residents with two homes in the state from going from home to home, even telling them they can't buy garden supplies and paint and stuff like that at stores.

And if some of them are caught doing so, they could be fined.

Well, that was the final straw for a lot of these protesters in Lansing, Michigan, which said, enough is enough.

Now, the governor did get a chance to address that in announcement to reporters a few moments ago, Governor Whitmer saying that they are the ones causing problems, not she. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WHITMER: We know that this rally endangered people. This kind of activity will put more people at risk.

And, sadly, it could prolong the amount of time we have to be in this posture.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAVUTO: All right, so, Governor Whitmer has not dialed back on any of those stringent measures.

And this traffic protest to say, this is going way too far, will probably not ease up. Some of the ralliers that we had been talking to, including one earlier leading this charge, in the show said they will not give up until she eases them.

It doesn't look, for the time being, like the governor will.

We will stay on top of it, as a number of states are looking at easing up on their own restrictions that have been in place now for the better part of three to four, in some cases six weeks in some states, like, for example, Ohio.

Then there's the issue of, what would make states do that? What would make the federal government be more inclined to consider that, working with the states?

You hear a lot about an improvement in the number of cases, new or otherwise, going down for 14 straight days. You have also heard a lot more about testing. We would need a lot more testing, so that we can know a lot more what we're dealing with here.

I want to explore that with Scott Whitaker, the AdvaMed president and CEO and the former chief of staff over at the Department of Health and Human Services.

Sir, very good to have you.

Where are we on COVID-19 testing? I know there are a variety of such tests available, including one that will look at antibodies, which could indicate whether you even ever had this yourself. But update me.  SCOTT WHITAKER, PRESIDENT AND CEO, ADVAMED: Yes, we're scaling up dramatically.

March 12 was the first test that was approved by the FDA. So, at that point, very few tests were being conducted at the time.

Today, there are about 20 tests on the market. We're scaling up to the point where we will have about 28 million tests available by the end of April. So it's tremendous progress.

But, Neil, that's just on the front end of diagnosing the disease. On the back end of determining how much immunity you have, those tests are in the process right now. We will see more of those in the coming weeks as well, as we work through the process with FDA.  CAVUTO: You know, Scott, I know there are a variety of different tests.

The idea is to get a good, strong sampling to know exactly what we're dealing with here. I know that we had started a little slow in this country, where one out of about 300,000 to 400,000 Americans were being tested. It's dramatically shrunk to, I'm told now, under one -- under -- 100,0000.

WHITAKER: Right.

CAVUTO: And I'm just wondering what you, as a top medical expert yourself, would like to see before even considering unwinding some of these sheltering provisions.

WHITAKER: Yes, I think there are two things, Neil.

We need more testing, for sure. And we're scaling up to do as much as we can, as I said, 28 million by the end of this month and scaling up even more dramatically as we move into the summer months. So that's one thing that we need, for sure.

I think continuing the work that we're doing on treating the disease, and also protecting health care workers is critically important as well, and then informing the public that it's not just diagnostic testing alone that gets people back to work, but it's diagnostic testing, along with the CDC rules that they have put on to continue the social distancing, to make sure that we're phasing our way back into the workplace in an appropriate way.

CAVUTO: Are you confident there will be an unwinding at the end of this month, the beginning of the next month?

WHITAKER: I'm confident that it will begin unwinding soon.

I don't know if we will be at the end of this month or the first of next month.

But I feel confident, the way that we have scaled up, the work that we're doing with the FDA to get more tests into market, more penetration, more access, all of those things are being done at such a rapid pace, I am confident that, the closer we get to the summer, the better prepared we will be for reentering the workplace.

And I'm -- we're anxious about that.

CAVUTO: Scott Whitaker, thanks for all your hard work yourself.

Appreciate it very, very much, and for that update.

We have a lot more coming up here, including what China knew and when it knew it about this virus -- after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)  (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARK ESPER, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: With regard to China and the information coming out of there, as many of us have spoken, from folks across the political spectrum, clearly, the Chinese could have been more transparent earlier and shared much more of the data.

We would had a better understanding of this virus, and then how to deal with it. And I think we -- even today, we see them withholding information.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAVUTO: All right, so, to Jennifer Griffin on all of this about what the Chinese knew and when they knew it, whether they deliberately deceived us, whether we're getting the real skinny on all that.

Jennifer, what are you hearing?

JENNIFER GRIFFIN, FOX NEWS NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, increasingly, Neil, U.S. intelligence is indicating the virus may have been accidentally released from a Chinese bio lab in Wuhan.

According to State Department e-mails from two years ago obtained by The Washington Post, U.S. Embassy officials visited the Chinese bio labs in Wuhan where scientists were studying coronavirus in bats and warned them about lax security.

Yesterday, I asked the chairman of the Joint Chiefs about the origins of the pandemic.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: Do you have any evidence the virus began in a Chinese lab?

GEN. MARK MILLEY, CHAIRMAN, JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF CHAIRMAN: There's a lot of rumor and speculation in a wide variety of media, the blog sites, et cetera.

It should be no surprise to you that we have taken a keen interest in that. And we have had a lot of intelligence take a hard look at that. And I would just say, at this point, it's inconclusive, although the weight of evidence seems to indicate natural.

But we don't know for certain.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: For years, the IAEA has inspected nuclear sites around the world.

I asked the defense secretary if this is what is needed for bio labs.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: And what about having inspectors in labs, bio labs? Do you think it's time to do that, like you do for nuclear facilities?

ESPER: I think that's something needs to be looked at after the fact.

There is going to be a -- at some point a lessons learned, if you will, that needs to be conducted. We have already begun it, by the way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: Last week, the Pentagon's top doctor ruled out a Chinese bioweapon was to blame. Defense Secretary Esper just said in an interview with FOX News today that China is still withholding crucial information that would help the world understand this pandemic, Neil.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: Do you have any new information or any suspicion that this COVID- 19 may have been the result of a bioweapon.

BRIG. GEN. PAUL FRIEDRICHS, JOINT STAFF SURGEON: No.

And if I could just be clear, there is nothing to that. I think there's -- someone asked me if I was worried. That is not something that I'm worried about. I think right now what we're concerned about is, how do we treat people who are sick? How do we prevent people from getting sick?

But, no, I'm not worried about this as a bioweapon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRIFFIN: That is the surgeon general for the Joint Chiefs of Staff -- Neil.

CAVUTO: Real quickly, this Iranian harassment of ships of ours in the Persian Gulf, anything there?

GRIFFIN: That's right.

We just received video that we're ingesting of 11 Iranian small vessels harassing six U.S. Naval warships in the Persian Gulf. They get within 10 yards of the U.S. Navy vessels. The incident lasted over an hour.

And the U.S. Navy had to warn those ships off. It was a very tense situation earlier today, Neil.

CAVUTO: Thank you, Jennifer Griffin.

We will have more after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)  CAVUTO: All right, these protests are going to continue in Michigan, because the governor isn't giving an inch. They're not giving an inch.

And we are likely to hear something from the president of the United States on this, when his health care task force meets in about half-an-hour.

Stay with us. You are watching FOX.

Here comes "THE FIVE."

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