Media pounce on report Trump wanted Hillary, Comey probes

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Media pounce on report Trump wanted Hillary, Comey probes

Critics are up in arms over a New York Times report about President Trump wanting the Justice Department to prosecute Hillary Clinton and James Comey; reaction and analysis on 'The Five.'

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," November 21, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Juan Williams along with Jedediah Bila, Steve Doocy, Dana Perino, and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City, and this is "The Five."

President Trump sparking another media firestorm, critics up in arms this time over a New York Times report about the president wanting the justice department to prosecute Hillary Clinton as well as former FBI director James Comey, some in the media sounding the alarm about Trump's intentions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a defining moment in the history of the Trump presidency because this is a demonstration of his unfitness to be President of the United States, of his abuse of presidential power, of his embrace of authoritarianism.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This news, I want to be clear with you, is a scale way beyond anything else we have seen in legal controversies with Donald Trump.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is what happens in authoritarian countries. The president orders -- the president -- the leader orders the investigation and prosecution of his political enemies.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIAMS: But supporters argue that Trump has been saying this for a long time, like during the presidential debate two years ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: If I win, I am going to instruct my attorney general to get a special prosecutor to look into your situation because there has never been so many lies, so much deception.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIAMS: So, Dana, you have a situation here where people, you know, like Alan Dershowitz today on Steve's show said you can do this. You do not use political -- you don't use the criminal justice system to punish your political opponents. What do you think?

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Well, I think that -- you can say a lot of things, right, inside a White House. You can say, I want this to happen.  And then you might have a general counsel that's very wise and smart and clever like Don McGahn who says it's not a good idea, Mr. President. We're not going to do that. And so, his lawyer is Bill Burke. He's being represented -- Bill Burke -- full disclosure, a good friend of mine. But he says McGahn is not going to comment on the legal advice he gave to the president, but he noted that the president never, to his knowledge, ordered anyone prosecute Hillary Clinton or James Comey.

So, again, it's like -- so he might have brought it up and may be you're frustrated -- they're going to investigate me, investigate her. I want you to investigate her. Sir, we can't do that. OK, fine. Like, we're not going to do that. And they move on. When they say that this is what happens in a dictatorship, no, what happens in a dictatorship is that the prosecution actually happens. And it's not a fair trial. There is no due process. And that person is immediately thrown in jail or extradited or something like that. That's now what happened in this case. So, that what I would say.

WILLIAMS: And, Steve, what would you say to people who say why is he discussing this and then other said, as you saw on the tape, that he's been saying this during the campaign. He was saying, oh, yeah, if I'm president, I'm going to get my special prosecutor. But McGahn and others told him this could result in your impeachment, Mr. President.

STEVE DOOCY, GUEST CO-HOST: Sure. And we have -- when the conversation that you're talking about, Juan, where we had Alan Dershowitz in the studio this morning, he said it's not impeachable but it's just dumb. He should not have done that. But I'll tell you what, he really amped it up, then candidate Donald Trump, because it's one thing for you to say it when you're out on the campaign trail. But then when you're sitting or standing right next to the person and saying if I win, big trouble. That's something. But that's Donald Trump.

WILLIAMS: But it sounds like rhetoric on the campaign trail, but when you're actually proposing I think is what set people off. So, Jedediah, you hear these claims of authoritarianism. You hear people saying this is worse than since Watergate. What do you think?

JEDEDIAH BILA, GUEST CO-HOST: It's ridiculous. I mean, what's the story here. I'm still trying to figure out what the story is. He didn't prosecute anybody, actually. You have his legal representation coming out and saying, yeah, we didn't hear him say that he was actually going to prosecute anybody. It's just so interesting that now the New York Times has gone from stories where they actually thought they were going to find collusion. Now they've decided, well, we didn't find the collusion we've been looking for. So now they're writing outrage stories about things he might have said that might have happened, and now you have cable news heads exploding over this. I don't see the story. He didn't prosecute anybody.  He didn't do anything about it. It's not a story if somebody says, oh, yeah, I'm going to do this and then nothing actually happens. What are we supposed to be upset about?

WILLIAMS: I mean, even if you have to restrain the president? The most powerful man.

BILA: Well, first of all, how do you even know that he actually had to restrain him? This is taken --

WILLIAMS: Well, Don McGahn wrote a memo, so the memo exists.

BILA: He wrote a memo -- OK. So -- but somebody saying -- and also like - - it's not just because -- he wasn't just saying these things because these people were -- you know, for example, Comey, for example. Oh, these are his adversaries. He was saying it because he had legitimate concerns about Hillary Clinton and bleaching a server, and taking a hammer to a server and saying, listen, I gonna -- you know, I think this should be looked into.  And that was a point that resonated with every American sitting at home saying what Comey did seems unreasonable. What she did seems unreasonable.  And it was a selling point for him to say this doesn't look right how this went down and I think it should be looked into. That's very different from him mandating prosecuting his enemies and actually following through like a dictator. He's not a dictator. Nothing about this is dictatorial.

WILLIAMS: OK. So, Greg, what do you make of this?

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: If you took every outraged that the media embraced that was born from Trump venting, you would have nothing, all right? His venting is defined by thinking out loud and wondering of what possibilities is out there that could solve something that bugs him. And then somebody says something to him and he goes OK. Then he finds something else. Trump is a salesman and a businessman. And what do you do when you enter a new job? You ask a bunch of questions. Some of the questions are incredibly stupid. And that is why Donald Trump is different than anybody in the media, because the media is too insecure to ask stupid questions. It's almost a superhero power that Trump has, his willingness not to feel shame when he's wrong and when he asks a dumb question. Hey, can I prosecute her? You can't prosecute her. Oh, OK.

There's this kind of amnesia that I read about where you forget whatever it's absorb that same day, so every new day is new. The media has Trump amnesia. They wake up every day as if it's the first day of the presidency and they freak out. In fact, I don't know why his critics are so fat, because they're always up in arms. They should be so fit. They should be so fit because they're always like this, screaming. They should be like on the cover of Men's Health. Instead, they're just bloated. How are they so bloated when they're so screaming all the time?

PERINO: Can I add one thing on this because Barack Obama campaigned on closing Gitmo.

GUTFELD: Yes.

PERINO: You remember? And you guys remember the other story that on his first day in the oval office after he's sworn in, he's sitting around there and he's like OK, where's the paperwork because I'm going to close Gitmo.  And his staff says, oh, sir, you actually can't do that. Actually, something that has to go through congress. He's like what do you mean I can't do that?

GUTFELD: Everybody does this.

PERINO: You can't do that because the law says -- and that's why you have smart people around you that can advise you on things that you might not necessarily know about that are detailed in the law.

WILLIAMS: So, Greg, just a quick responds to what you said. I think that the liberal side would say are we normalizing was is very unusual behavior?  The president trying to use the justice department to punish --

GUTFELD: No, I think that, A, the word normalizing should not be normalized. I hate that word. Number two, I think we're saying that the Trump amnesia, the psychology of this is people are exhausted by him, OK.  And so, here's an experiment. If you erase Trump from today, you'd have the largest peacetime expansion probably in history. Dramatic declines in poverty and violence worldwide. Aside from Syria, Afghanistan, things are looking pretty good. There's a lot of prosperity. There's a lot of fresh ideas and new technology. It's a simpler but somehow complicated life with technology. So my point is, despite this, there's a sense of doom around the corner. Everybody thinks something awful is happening even though the physical evidence is telling you there's optimism everywhere and the reason is it's because all of this is a psychological problem. This is a psychological problem. It certainly isn't a physical one.

WILLIAMS: All right, all right. I guess that's why, you know -- that's why he has like thirty-something percent approval.

GUTFELD: No, it's actually higher than that. You misrepresented that.

WILLIAMS: All right. And then there's President Trump saying it's a no- brainer on who he thinks should be named Time Magazine's person of the year.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: It's called person of the year, right? It's no longer man of the year, right? I don't know. That's up to Time Magazine. I've been there before. I can't imagine anybody else other than Trump.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(LAUGHTER)

GUTFELD: Even you find that funny. You find that funny.

WILLIAMS: So, wait. Is he serious?

BILA: I think he's partially serious, I do. I think this is how he is though. This is like -- people who don't get that still just don't get Trump. But that's just how he feels. He feels like, hey, listen, I'm the president. I'm doing a whole bunch of cool stuff. I can be man of the year. I don't think they're going to pick him.

DOOCY: But, Juan, person of the year or man of the year or thing of the year, you know, I looked it up and apparently it is the greatest influence on the events of the year. Who has influenced more things in the past year?

PERINO: Maybe on the merits it will be him, but it's going to be Pelosi, right? I think she's going to get person of the year. They just -- they're at 39 seats flipped. She's going to be speaker again. It's not a man. It's a woman. I'm just telling you on the merits Trump might deserve it, but I am putting my markdown --

GUTFELD: And you're rarely wrong on this. I will say -- you know what's great -- I thought we're going to talk about the correspondents' dinner.  There's another example of where Trump made something better. The dinner has now returned to its roots --

PERINO: Thank God.

GUTFELD: -- which is about the importance of journalism. After decades of celebrity worship, it was the curse of the press. You know, the insecure and homely in the media, you know, always wanting to be near the cool kids.  Trump cured them of that.

PERINO: Yep, I agree.

DOOCY: And now that they don't have the comic after him --

GUTFELD: Yes.

DOOCY: -- he's gonna go.

PERINO: And then he said he might go. And then, he'll be the funniest speech they've had.

WILLIAMS: He'll be the funniest speech, I'm sure. It'll just be uproarious, I could see that.

GUTFELD: You will be laughing, Juan.

WILLIAMS: No, no, I can't laugh --

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: -- people will say Juan is laughing at the president.

GUTFELD: No, laugh with the president.

PERINO: Laugh with the president.

WILLIAMS: Oh, OK. President Trump standing firm in supporting Saudi Arabia despite the outrage after a Washington Post columnist murdered.  Details on this next on The Five.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUTFELD: All right, I know, I have a hole in my sweater. I should not have raised my hand. I raised my hand. You know where it's from? It's from working out.

WILLIAMS: Do you know what happened?

GUTFELD: What?

WILLIAMS: So I was in the green room before and I said this is Greg's sweater.

(LAUGHTER)

GUTFELD: All right. So, did the prince kill Khashoggi? Maybe he did.  Maybe he didn't. That's from Trump causing today's hair burning media freak out, which happens whenever Trump tells the blunt truth about a policy we were OK with well before him. So now you're pissed off over the Saudis after decades of human right abuses and terror enabling? This is what gets your goat? According to Ben Rhodes, in 2009 when Obama went to Riyadh, the Saudi king gave each staffer a pile of jewels and the first couple got a hundred thousand pounds worth of bubbles which were accepted and then sent to the national archives. That beats a washer and dryer on Price is Right.

But even back then we knew Saudi Arabia, they were different but they were allies and allies can suck. So may be the bosses' son had Khashoggi off or maybe not, which is it? Think hard. It's a card game. If you say the prince is guilty, you're committing poker suicide by folding while holding all the best cards. Sure, playing your moral ace might please everyone in the media, but winning their approval wins American nothing. It's just waste of great opportunity. But hold off and say maybe, maybe not. Maybe not, you come out ahead and the pot you want to win impact your country's happiness.

If you spent your life playing this game, keeping your cards close and waiting, you know America has the Saudis over a barrel, millions of barrels, really. And in negotiations that means you can get something big from them that you couldn't get before. Like what? Middle East progress, a chance for peace in Palestine and Israel, the ability to influence oil prices, who knows? For sure it will be more than a pile of dumb jewels.

All right, Dana, this is another example of what I say we'll see what happens. We'll see what happens. Like if the Saudis don't offer America something really big, then you can go back in six months and say they killed that guy. He can't hurt -- he's got that option.

PERINO: Maybe you're right. Maybe you're not. Exclamation point.

GUTFELD: You'll never know.

PERINO: Exclamation point was the one I was like --

GUTFELD: But that's how he talks.

PERINO: Right. OK, look, friends can sometimes make it really hard to defend them.

GUTFELD: Tell me about it.

PERINO: OK. I know what they're talking about. But, no, that's the thing -- it's -- obviously, it's a complex situation. The end result was maybe always going to be this --

GUTFELD: Yeah.

PERINO: -- OK. But then the way -- communications is important, right?  Yeah, maybe he's speaking to a certain audience, if you're speaking to a lot of different audience all at once. And then the tweet today where he says oil prices getting lower.

GUTFELD: Yes.

PERINO: Great. And he thanks Saudi Arabia for that. Over a barrel?  Like, maybe that -- the shoe's on the other foot. And if oil prices were the real intentions, making the tough decision to get out of the Iran deal would have been the wrong one if oil prices are the real intentions.

GUTFELD: I don't think it is.

PERINO: I don't think it is because it's complex.

GUTFELD: It is.

PERINO: But it doesn't say that in these tweets, and that is a tough thing. I think that human rights is in our national security's interest.  I think this is obviously very difficult. I also feel like the president could have gotten more out of this. You're saying that Saudi -- we should get something out of this, but why would we get anything now when he's already said everything is cool.

GUTFELD: No, I think he's working on --

PERINO: Well, I think -- well, maybe so, maybe behind the scenes. But wouldn't it have been great if we had found out today that Saudi had released all the women that they put in detention because they had the temerity to get out there and drive before their regulations were allowed?  Or maybe -- like all these other things we could have asked for them to do from a human rights standpoint.

GUTFELD: I think our national security interests are our national security interests. That's a hard reality. I think that's what -- I think what we're going for is something in the Middle East that's bigger -- bigger than oil.

WILLIAMS: But didn't he say the same thing about Russia and Vladimir Putin? He's going to be a helpful ally --

GUTFELD: I would use North Korea as an example.

WILLIAMS: And now he's saying -- but the fact is, Greg, it's not about our national interests to have our morals, our principles --

GUTFELD: You're looking at the tiniest part of this.

WILLIAMS: Hang on. Let me finish. We're saying to people who are dictators and who are murderers, you know what, you can do business with us. It's all transactional as long as you promise us more jobs and more oil. But wait a second. It's not true. He says it's $350 billion, tens of thousands of jobs, every fact-checker in America said that's not true.  So the transaction is one-sided. We're saying to them you know what, go right ahead. And to me, that is -- it's unacceptable, Greg.

GUTFELD: You know what? Here's the way I look at it. See, if he took -- he took the hard way out. He could have virtue signaled and made all of you guys happy, but he didn't. He doesn't need to satisfy morning blow, you know. Instead, he embraces the role of the cold hard parent who is right. If you just focus on this one incident and blow the future, it doesn't make sense.

DOOCY: When you look at what is happening right now in Washington, there're a lot of lawmakers who are saying, you know, we want sanctions.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

DOOCY: And President Trump said --

(CROSSTALK)

PERINO: They're the sanctions on 12 people who are slated to be killed.  So, what do the sanctions matter?

DOOCY: Well, but the president says you want sanctions? Congress then passed sanctions.

GUTFELD: Right, right.

DOOCY: I think I heard Rush Limbaugh on the radio yesterday say something about, you know, people in Europe are saying, well, what's the president going to do? We're waiting on him to do something. Well, why doesn't Europe do something --

PERINO: They did. But Germany today ended their arms sales. That's not necessarily in their best interest either. It's not in your best interest for a country that you need in the Middle East to not buy your weapons.  You want them to buy your weapons.

DOOCY: Right. So what is the president going to do? I think he's doing it. He's a businessman. I think, ultimately -- how many times have you heard businessmen say it's nothing personal.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

DOOCY: It's just business. In this case, it's America's business.

BILA: I think he could have done that. I agree with you that he looked at it from the perspective of a businessman. I think he could have done that though and made the statement better. Had he done the very same thing that he did but within that statement been harder when it came to the murder of a journalist, be less tolerant of that. There were angles of the statement where he almost seemed like he was taking the Saudi crown prince's version of the story over the intelligence community and what their finding. You can't do that.

So if he wants to maintain that this a strategic ally, if he wants to come at it from the angle of a businessman, I think that's all OK to an extent, but you have to acknowledge that there's a whole bunch of people looking at this that want the message sent that if a regime violates human rights extensively they expect an American president to have a reaction to that that's substantial and makes you feel like, you know, he cares about our economic interests but he also cares about the value of the whole country - -

GUTFELD: You know who agrees with you? Turkey. And, you know, I'm so happy to see Turkey come out against human rights abuses and comes after us over that.

WILLIAMS: But, you know what? It's not just Turkey. I mean, you could say that --

GUTFELD: There's a lot of Turkeys.

WILLIAMS: Especially this time of the year. But what strikes me is the number of Republicans.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

WILLIAMS: And normally with President Trump being as popular as he is among Republicans, you don't see the senate and the congress step up to him. But what we're seeing is Marco Rubio, Rand Paul, Lindsey Graham, Bob Corker, Jeff Flake, I mean, these guys were saying this is wrong. We are Americans. We stand for human rights.

GUTFELD: Yes. I wish they had a broader perspective but, oh, well.  Serious hypocrisy from Michael Avenatti, his legal team now attacking the credibility of his accuser, and a big update on his potential legal troubles, that's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BILA: Breaking just minutes ago, Michael Avenatti will not face felony charges over a domestic abuse allegation, the L.A. County district attorney passing the case off to city prosecutors who could still charge him with a misdemeanor. This comes after Avenatti's legal team attacked his accuser's credibility in a letter to LAPD. They claimed she was drunk at the time and saying an alleged mark on her leg was most likely caused by acne medication. This move being called hypocritical because last month Avenatti railed against the senate judiciary committee's treatment of his client, Julie Swetnick, telling Vanity Fair, quote, you don't call them a liar. You don't say they're not credible at the same time being prevent any reasonable investigation into their allegations. Hypocritical, Greg?  His treatment of Kavanaugh and now the expectation he has of --

GUTFELD: He's just an awful person. I mean, calling him hypocritical, he's a lawyer. I mean, and lawyers -- they know all the tricks. It's like they have the instructions to a game board of life that you don't have. So when -- like he writes the letter to the police. He mentions apparently that Accutane had a role in this. Only a lawyer would do that. And he mentioned some other syndromes that you might have had, issues with plastic surgery. So he might possibly get off and maybe he should because we believe in justice and due process, unlike when he targeted Kavanaugh.  He's getting better treatment than he gave Kavanaugh. And I only hope that that helps him grow in some way. I think he's done as a personality and a politician, but I felt that way about Al Sharpton after Tawana Brawley and the Freddy fashion mark, you know, tragedy.

BILA: You know it's interesting, Juan, because with Kavanaugh, there was no evidence that was brought forth. And here you have sworn declaration from her in addition to a police report, supposedly you have evidence of marks on her body. There was a restraining order that she was able to get.  And he's saying, you know, I want a full and fair investigation. With all of this stuff out there, and yet he didn't apply that to somebody who had accusations come out from X amount of years ago where no one was able to bring forth any amount of evidence other than this testimony --

WILLIAMS: No, to the contrary, I think he brought forth a woman that he said had some evidence. What he said turned out not to be true.

BILA: Right.

WILLIAMS: And, of course, we know that Professor Ford sat down and gave testimony. She put herself directly forward. In the case of Avenatti in this -- I'm understanding that he still may face some charges.

BILA: Yeah. Referred to the senate, due to the FBI --

WILLIAMS: Well, no, no. I mean, he could be facing misdemeanor charges.  I don't know exactly all the details. As you say, it's just breaking. But to me, the issue is should she be heard? And, of course, she should be heard. If that's the charge against Avenatti, I don't think that anybody is saying we're not going to listen to this woman. Don't bring -- I mean, that why I've said yesterday, I don't think it's fair to Kavanaugh because this is immediate. This is right here, right now. Let's hear the woman.  Let's consider the charges. In the Kavanaugh case, these things were when he was a teenage guy. He must be in his 50's, right? So, I mean, that's the difference.

BILA: Now he seeing, though, the problem with a believe her hashtag on instant one, which is that you should have an investigation, that you should go through a process, and you can't just believe someone, man or woman, Steve, if you just -- you know, without evidence of an outgoing due process. So now, I wonder if on the other side of this he's saying -- you know, he's having to make the very arguments that he was fighting against when it came to Kavanaugh, and he's having to make those arguments to defend himself now.

DOOCY: I was talking to somebody down in Washington about these developments today, and they were talking just about the political component, because you know, he's been mentioned among the three dozen Democrats who might run for president of the United States. And this is a D.C. Republican observer.

He said he should run. It would be the best thing that could happen to the Republican Party. He said the Republicans need him on the campaign trail with as much exposure as during the Stormy Daniels days. Keep him on cable. Every time he does appear, he helps the Republican Party.

BILA: Yes.

PERINO: That's exactly why he won't be. Like, to Greg's point, what he's done is, like, there's -- they want to try to help the Democrat win in 2020. So Michael Avenatti is not going to be it. And if they think that Avenatti is a detriment to the Democrats or could help Republicans, he's not going to be much --

GUTFELD: Maybe they set him up. The Dems.

WILLIAMS: The Dems?

PERINO: Yes.

WILLIAMS: You know, Greg is good.

But the other side of this is, guess what? Hmm. Somebody who had relations with porn stars who make charges against him and is an embarrassing incident. Oh, gosh, and he got elected president.

GUTFELD: Wait a minute. He never made charges against Stormy. He paid her off. In fact, that's a fair point.

WILLIAMS: He paid her off.

GUTFELD: No, no, no. He treated -- he treated Stormy with the respect she deserved. It was a business transaction, unlike -- unlike this doofus, who actually used Stormy for his career, used this other woman, Swetnick, for his career. Used his victims to get himself a spotlight. All Trump did was hire her for what she does. And paid her. And what -- and what she did was wrong. She reneged on a contract.

BILA: Even before this, though, before this story came out -- we don't know what happened here. It has to be investigated. Dana, do you actually think he would have had any chance? Because he -- I mean, the way he handled Swetnick. The way there were contradictory statements. It was referred to the FBI for potential criminal investigation just for that.  But just his demeanor and the way he is, I didn't think he was formidable - -

PERINO: Politically?

BILA: Yes.

PERINO: No, I don't. I think when they -- they're going to have upwards of 35 candidates that want to throw their hat in the ring. I just think that -- he's not going to emerge out of that, necessarily.

GUTFELD: Well, you never know.

WILLIAMS: You know what? The Democrats want a fighter. Right? Avenatti was advertising himself as someone who could go toe-to-toe --

GUTFELD: Right.

WILLIAMS: -- and throw bombs with Trump.

GUTFELD: Yes.

WILLIAMS: But I just -- I don't think that Democrats should go down that path. Do you?

PERINO: No.

BILA: That's why you won't see him.

Don't go anywhere. "Wild Card Wednesday" is coming up.

PERINO: Oh, my favorite. OK, good.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PERINO: Welcome back. It's "Wild Card Wednesday."

(GRAPHIC: SLOT MACHINE WITH TITLE "WILD CARD WEDNESDAY")

PERINO: Look at that, Steve Doocy.

DOOCY: Wow.

PERINO: Steve, let me explain. We each picked a topic and put them in this hat.

DOOCY: Yes.

PERINO: None of us know the other's stories.

DOOCY: Right.

PERINO: OK. So I'm going to pick it out, and then we're going to read it real quickly and we're going to discuss.

DOOCY: All right.

PERINO: Ramen restaurant has focus booths for avoiding human contact.  Ichiran is a Japanese ramen noodle restaurant that features 46 focus booths which allow guests to have some time alone with their food. Customers also write their orders on a piece of paper so they even don't have to interact with a waiter.

I chose this story. And I am for this, because have you ever seen people eat ramen noodles?

WILLIAMS: Yes.

PERINO: I don't want to see it.

DOOCY: It's a lot of slurping.

PERINO: I don't want to hear it.

GUTFELD: Be careful. You know what's funny? Walked down Sixth Avenue and people are sitting during their lunch, and they're eating and facing the windows. Almost the entire part of their face is dead except for their mouth. They're just eating. It's the strangest -- they're just chewing.  And you're walking up, and you look and people are just chewing. Ah-ra-ra- ra-ra. Ah-ra-ra-ra-ra-ra.

WILLIAMS: What's going on over there?

DOOCY: He's stuck.

WILLIAMS: He's stuck.

PERINO: Honestly. I think this is not a bad idea. I think you could -- I don't understand that you have to write down your order so you don't have to interact with people. You like people, right?

DOOCY: Yes. See, I like to have a meal and be social. This is the polar opposite of this. It's --

PERINO: But what about ramen noodle meal?

DOOCY: Well, I mean, there is some slurping.

PERINO: Yes.

DOOCY: And stuff like that, but I'm OK. I'm on TV. People see me do crazy stuff all the time.

PERINO: Jedediah, you like this?

BILA: I tried to avoid people as much as possible. So for me, the not having to even order, that was the best part.

PERINO: Juan, what do you think? You're very social here.

WILLIAMS: I just wonder, so how do you go on a date?

PERINO: Well, you wouldn't take your date to this restaurant. Another restaurant.

WILLIAMS: "I really want to go out with you, so you sit over there. I'm going to be over here, and we won't see each other."

BILA: That could be a great thing.

PERINO: In Japan, you know what their birthrate is over there. It's not good.

OK, "Wild Card Wednesday." U.K. school bans Canada Goose goats -- not goats. Canada Goose coats, other expensive style so that kids won't feel pressured. A British high school has banned students from wearing Canada Goose and other designer winter coats in an attempt to poverty-proof its campus. The school's head teacher said students had approached school leaders about the pressure on families and the pressure on themselves to wear particular branded coats.

BILA: Yes, this is mine.

PERINO: This is why uniforms are a good idea, right?

BILA: This is mine, but it makes me mad, because this is not prepping kids for real life. I mean, you're going to grow up, and you're going to be surrounded by a bunch of people that wear better clothes than you, make more money than you, that walk down the street and sometimes look better than you. And you've got to --

GUTFELD: Not me. Yet to happen.

BILA: Not you, of course. But the rest of us. And you've got to kind of build that tough skin in these kids. I mean, I'm not -- I'm not into it.

WILLIAMS: I disagree, I disagree. I think I'm for uniforms, and I'm also thinking that if you're a poor kid, look, there's enough on you. And I've seen schools, districts where they say to the kids, enough with the fancy sneakers that cost 100 bucks or 200 bucks because you want to show off to your friends. That's not what you show off about. Show off about your intellect or your discipline.

I'm all for that. I just think that, you know, kids use this as a status symbol. It's wrong values, and I'm glad that the school is doing it.

PERINO: Greg, you lived in the U.K. for a while. This doesn't surprise you, I presume?

GUTFELD: Well, I -- I understand what Juan is saying. But I do believe that. I hate rules that are dictated by the mob or by -- like, by the group. Because you should have the choice to dress however you feel.  Although I am a big fan of uniforms, especially at certain clubs I go to.

PERINO: Yes, yes. Steve Doocy.

GUTFELD: I wore a uniform for eight years.

BILA: I had a uniform and I hated it. I hated it because I felt like I didn't have a chance to figure -- like, clothes is time to figure out who you are.

PERINO: Clothes. Take it --

GUTFELD: We had casual Fridays, though.

BILA: I would take one now, though.

DOOCY: The only uniform I ever wore growing up was the Boy Scouts.

BILA: Oh, that's good.

DOOCY: And then was I was in the Future Farmers of America, I had the blue jacket.

PERINO: Yes. The jacket, right. Those are very popular.

All right, "Wild Card Wednesday." University staff told not to use "don't," or frightening capital letters. This is also in the U.K., of course. Honestly. The U.K. [SIC] said professors should not use certain words or syntax in case they trigger anxiety in their students and lead to academic failure. The use of capital letters has been banned, as well as the overuse of the words "do" and "don't."

GUTFELD: This was my choice. It's just -- it's just obviously so sad. We are definitely breeding a certain kind of individual that will not survive in the outside world.

PERINO: Right. Right, right, right.

DOOCY: Look at the banner underneath us right now. It's all in caps.

"Capital offense!"

PERINO: Juan, your thoughts.

WILLIAMS: I think this -- it's almost like that was made for Greg. Right?  Because of Greg's complaint about the academy in this country. But this is Britain, right?

GUTFELD: Yes.

WILLIAMS: But I mean, I don't get it. It just -- it seems silly, overly protective. This goes back to what you were saying about uniforms, I guess. People who should live in the real world. Because if you think a professor telling you "do it" is kind of tough, try a boss who could actually fire you.

GUTFELD: I'd like -- how about an idea of a place that sells hats with Trump sayings and it's called "All Caps."

PERINO: It could be, like, for the Washington hockey team.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

PERINO: The Capitals.

GUTFELD: Wow, all Caps.

PERINO: Right. This last one, porch-raiding woman dubbed "the Grinch" caught on camera swiping packages from Michigan homes. How dare she?  Police posted a video of this woman. She was filmed stealing people's deliveries from their homes during the holiday season.

The woman was deemed Grinchy by the Sterling Heights Police Department.

GUTFELD: Of course, it's blocked. Remove the lower third. Jeez.

PERINO: Police have now identified the woman but not released her information to the public.

DOOCY: Well, by process of elimination, you can tell this is mine. And the reason I watched this is because a month ago, we installed one of these doorbells. And so now every time somebody comes to my house, I get --

PERINO: Doesn't it drive you nuts?

WILLIAMS: Wait a minute. I think it's Thomas Jefferson.

DOOCY: That is George Washington. Came to our house. And my daughter was at work. And she called me up, and she said, "Dad, it's 4:16 in the afternoon. George Washington is at the front door, and he's got a bottle of wine."

PERINO: That is so weird.

DOOCY: It turns out it was Halloween, and the neighbor always comes over.

GUTFELD: I thought that was -- you know what? Come on. It was a strip-o- gram. Come on, Steve.

PERINO: You never know.

WILLIAMS: I was hoping it was Ed McMahon.

PERINO: We didn't get to Juan's. It was about this mom. She's a blogger, and she was complaining she doesn't get likes from her son on Instagram.

GUTFELD: Likes for her son.

BILA: Wow.

PERINO: For her son. Or from her son. For her son. That's pretty sad.

GUTFELD: Is it?

WILLIAMS: She said --

PERINO: Those are kind of depressing. "Wild Card Wednesday."

But up next, Steve has got a big Thanksgiving surprise for us. You don't want to miss it. I don't want to miss it. "The Five" returns in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DOOCY: You know, while millions of Americans get together over the next couple of days for Thanksgiving, there are some tough topics that could divide them. And no, I'm not talking about politics. Like, which side dishes are the best? Or one writer is claiming 4 p.m. is the correct time to start eating. Here we are at 5:47. It seems about right for us. And is it still Thanksgiving if you don't serve turkey?

While we ponder these questions, I have a special surprise. We are celebrating early with some tasty recipes --

BILA: Oh, good.

DOOCY: -- from my brand-new cookbook. Came out last month. "The Happy Cook Book: A Celebration of the Food That Makes America Smile," which I co- wrote with my lovely wife, pictured right there, Kathy Doocy.

And the whole idea is that there are certain foods that make you happy.  And every time -- like right now you can smell the gravy. You can smell the pie. You can smell the dressing. And it just takes you back, Juan Williams, to a time when life was simpler, and your mom was making this and everything in life was --

GUTFELD: That's so sexist.

WILLIAMS: Well, it's true. It was my mom. And I love it. You know, the thing about cooking is it's -- what do they say, comfort food? Comfort?  And this is comfort food for me. I just find it comfortable, and it reminds me of good times and traditions and family. I love it for that.

GUTFELD: It makes me discomfort. It's discomfort. When you're done eating it, you feel like you're going to explode. You've got to unbutton your pants.

BILA: I like that feeling.

GUTFELD: I don't.

DOOCY: What's your favorite side dish at Thanksgiving?

GUTFELD: Oh, jeez. The wine.

DOOCY: Let me tell you what we've got today. We have right over here -- these are all recipes in the cookbook. This is Sarah Huckabee Sanders' famous bourbon pecan --

PERINO: It smells very good.

DOOCY: --pie right there. Then you've got --

PERINO: You don't have to spin that.

DOOCY: This is Dr. Oz's sweet potatoes. This is my wife, Kathy's. You know, a lot of people --

PERINO: I love cranberries.

DOOCY: A lot of people just take the can of cranberries and pour it out on a saucer, and you can still see the indentation of the can.

GUTFELD: They should be shot.

DOOCY: This has got coffee and Cointreau and it's --

GUTFELD: Coffee?

DOOCY: Coffee in it.

WILLIAMS: Wow.

DOOCY: She poaches the pears in it.

This is a turkey recipe. Remember Alan Thicke from the TV?

GUTFELD: "Candid Camera."

DOOCY: Absolutely.

GUTFELD: No, not "Candid Camera."

DOOCY: That's Allen --

GUTFELD: Fudd -- Ludd -- Lunt --

DOOCY: No, Allen Funt. Alan Thicke was the --

GUTFELD: Comedian.

DOOCY: -- 80's sit-com dad. This is his favorite recipe.

WILLIAMS: It's good. Is it smoked?

DOOCY: No. It's made with vermouth. And then this is my wife's, Kathy's, recipe.

PERINO: It's very good. Actually delicious.

GUTFELD: Everything has booze in it.

WILLIAMS: You forgot the best part, man.

BILA: The gravy is delicious.

DOOCY: What is the best time, Jedediah, to have Thanksgiving dinner?

BILA: You know, well, I mean, my house is very Italian. So we do, like, an antipasto before the thing. So we start out at, like, 3. But I think you've got to eat by 4, because you know, you smell it; and you can't smell it for too long without going crazy.

DOOCY: Yes.

BILA: You've got to eat it. I think 4 p.m.

PERINO: Also, you can eat too much of the appetizer, right?

BILA: And then you can't -- you have no room for the stuffing.

PERINO: I like at 2 p.m.

WILLIAMS: Wow.

DOOCY: Well, the problem with 2 p.m. is then you've got to start at, like, 8 a.m. in the morning.

BILA: That's fine.

PERINO: That's fine.

DOOCY: I'm just saying.

PERINO: You're a morning person. What's wrong with that?

GUTFELD: What time does Boston Market open? That's when I -- that's when ( --

PERINO: This is wonderful.

GUTFELD: Whatever happened to Boston Market?

WILLIAMS: You also have to figure in the time of the football games, right?

DOOCY: Sure.

WILLIAMS: And you've got -- and the problem with 2 p.m., Dana, is then you're hungry again by, like, 6 a.m., right?

BILA: That's when you get the leftovers.

PERINO: Then you get leftovers. That's when you make a turkey sandwich with Miracle Whip.

WILLIAMS: Oh, I see. I was thinking that's Friday after Thanksgiving.

PERINO: No, this is delicious, Steve. I'm so glad you did this, because I'm going to go to the theater tonight, and I didn't have -- I was going to eat one of -- bars.

GUTFELD: You're going to feel really uncomfortable. You're going to have to go to the bathroom.

DOOCY: What?

PERINO: Not everyone is like you.

GUTFELD: No, it's like in the middle of the -- "Oh, I ate too much." It will be so embarrassing. You're going to have to get up. People are going to wonder, "Why is she -- where she's going?"

DOOCY: Well, these are our recipes, but Judy, the food stylist, put it all together for us.

PERINO: Thanks, Judy.

DOOCY: Yes, very nicely done.

PERINO: And the book is wonderful. Makes a great Christmas gift. Because people love FOX, love FOX News, family-oriented viewers. I recommended it.

DOOCY: Listen, there's also a recipe in there from Dana Perino.

PERINO: that's right.

GUTFELD: What is it?

BILA: What is it?

PERINO: Queso.

GUTFELD: Is it called "Call Seamless"?.

PERINO: It's called -- it was my Magic Queso.

GUTFELD: Why is it magic?

PERINO: Because it has a special ingredient in it.

GUTFELD: Because you said, because it's magically --

PERINO: Not that special.

WILLIAMS: Hey, Steve, but you've got to have ice cream.

DOOCY: We're going to have that for dessert.

BILA: You can put ice cream on top of the pie.

WILLIAMS: All right.

DOOCY: Anyway, happy Thanksgiving.

WILLIAMS: To you and your family.

PERINO: Thank you.

DOOCY: "One More Thing," dessert, is up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WILLIAMS: Welcome back. It's time for fund, or "One More Thing" -- Dana.

PERINO: Well, and it's time for this, do we have a little graphic?

DOOCY: Like that?

GRAPHIC: Dana's Corny Jokes

PERINO: Uh-oh. "Dana's Cream Corn Jokes." OK, I've got a few of them here. They're turkey-related, or Thanksgiving.

DOOCY: OK.

PERINO: OK, what did the turkey say to the turkey hunter on Thanksgiving day? What did the turkey say to the turkey hunter?

DOOCY: Something gobble.

PERINO: "Quack-quack."

DOOCY: What?

GUTFELD: Ohh!

PERINO: Like a diversion, get it? What you call a running turkey?

WILLIAMS: A trotter. A trotter. No.

PERINO: Fast food.

WILLIAMS: Fast food!

PERINO: All right. What did sick people do on the Mayflower?

GUTFELD: Die. Let's be honest.

PERINO: They went to the doc.

That's funny. Greg, come on. You're not laughing at all today.

What did the turkey say to the computer?

"Google, Google, Google."

GUTFELD: Oh.

PERINO: OK. Last one, if pilgrims traveled on the Mayflower, what do college students travel on?

GUTFELD: What college students?

PERINO: If pilgrims traveled on the Mayflower, what do colleges students travel on?

DOOCY: I can't read it.

PERINO: Scholarships!

BILA: Oh!

DOOCY: Scholar ships.

GUTFELD: That's terrible.

PERINO: A great segment, right? Steve, you want to add this to "FOX & Friends"?

GUTFELD: I feel really sick.

DOOCY: That's not too bad. I'm getting kind of a buzz from the bourbon pie.

WILLIAMS: All right, all right, all right.

DOOCY: It seemed hilarious.

WILLIAMS: Here we go. I've got a "One More Thing" for you, Steve. A lot of people are off to Grandma's house for Thanksgiving, as you know. The airlines predict 50 -- 30 million people will be in the air, but nearly 50 million will be on the road and traveling 50 miles or more. And I think -- I think they were all on the road last night in L.A.

Take a look at this. Yes, that's the 405 Freeway in L.A. aerial video shows total, complete gridlock. Local traffic reporters said normally, they advised wait an hour, let the traffic ease up, but last night there was no easing up. It was just a parking lot. Apparently, some people left early for the holidays, but they didn't mean they got home any earlier.  They were just sitting in their cars.

PERINO: Wow.

DOOCY: Look at that.

BILA: Wow.

GUTFELD: Traffic jam in L.A. We should have led with that.

All right. My podcast is up. Go to FOXNewsPodcast.com with the legendary writer and futurist, George Gilder. We talk about his new book, "Life After Google." It's great.

Now it's time for this.

GRAPHIC: Greg's Cat-Off

GUTFELD: "Greg's Cat-off." We're going to do this fast. Steve hasn't done this before. Three cat videos. You guys vote.

First one, it's a thriller in vanilla. Two cats fighting it out. Who wins? We don't know. They're both winning in adorable.

Next one, we have celebrity cat! He doesn't want to be recognized, does he? That's why he's got his shades on. It looks a little bit like, I don't know.

Anyway, it's raining. So what does this cat put on? It's little raincoat.  Look at that.

BILA: Ohhh.

GUTFELD: Isn't that nice? Pleasant. Hmm.

So we have three cat videos. Put them up there. Jed, what's your fave?

BILA: I like a good cat fight. I'm going with No. 1.

GUTFELD: You always like a good cat fight.

BILA: True.

GUTFELD: Juan.

WILLIAMS: I think that is a cool cat in the middle.

GUTFELD: All right, cool cat.

DOOCY: I like Thrilla in Vanilla, too.

GUTFELD: That's two to one.

PERINO: I like the cool cat.

GUTFELD: Two, two. I break the tie, or I go with a raincoat cat. And leave it with that.

WILLIAMS: All right. Steve.

DOOCY: "One More Thing," a lot of fire departments across the country are putting out videos of the dangers of deep frying your turkey. Look at that right there.

PERINO: Oh, my gosh. How does it do that?

DOOCY: So these are some of the dos and the don'ts. Do read the fryer instructions. Don't fill up the oil to the top. Don't drop it in like you're spiking a football. Don't fry it frozen, and don't fry indoors and not on a wooden deck.

If you're looking for a turkey recipe that won't blow up your kitchen, page 176 --

PERINO: Nice.

DOOCY: -- of "The Happy Cookbook," which is available everywhere. Get it today, and you'll have it tomorrow.

WILLIAMS: Jedediah.

BILA: Yes, well, I have a dog, as you know, Emma, and be careful on Thanksgiving when you're cooking that amazing food that stuff doesn't fall on the floor, because once a grape fell on Thanksgiving, and it landed Mommy in the animal hospital with Emma, spending $1,200 to have somebody throw up. Glad to say that while you're all eating.

So foods that you have to avoid: onions, chocolate, stuff with Xylitol.

WILLIAMS: I've got to go. That's it for us. I'm going to avoid all that food. Be sure to join us, though, tomorrow for our Thanksgiving fan mail special.

PERINO: Oh, yes.

WILLIAMS: We're answering all of your questions for this hour, so please don't miss it. And "Special Report" up next.

Hey, Bret. Happy Thanksgiving.

BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS: Hey, Juan, thanks. Happy Thanksgiving to you.

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