Karl Rove on tightening presidential race, says President Trump needs to expand appeal beyond GOP base
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This is a rush transcript from "Hannity," September 2, 2020. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
TREY GOWDY, FOX NEWS HOST: Thank you, Tucker.
Welcome to “Hannity.” Now, I'm Trey Gowdy, in tonight for Sean.
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We begin with breaking news. Joe Biden left the basement today, he really did. In a very rare public appearance on the campaign trail, Biden delivered a short speech near his home in Delaware and he actually took a few questions from reporters, but those questions were hand-picked by campaign staffers. Watch this.
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JOE BIDEN, DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Stop your boast about never being seeing in what -- you can do anything. You always talk about your ability to negotiate. Negotiate a deal. A deal for somebody other than yourself.
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Now, I'm happy to take questions you may have. I guess the staff is going to call on whoever, follow, fire away.
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GOWDY: Joe Biden's public events are so rare that President Trump has a new nickname for his challenger -- Joe Hiden.
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Meanwhile, the Trump campaign is hitting Biden and the more radical element of his base hard, ahead of the Democrat's first trip to Wisconsin in several years. Watch.
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AD ANNOUNCER: Lawless criminals terrorize Kenosha, Joe Biden takes a knee. Biden and the radical left's weak response has led to chaos and violence, and their calls for defunding police would make it worse.
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GOWDY: Tomorrow, Joe Biden will visit Kenosha. And even though the officer involved shooting of Jacob Blake is still under investigation, that has not stopped Biden and Kamala Harris from making their own charging decisions. Take a look.
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REPORTER: Last week, your running mate Senator Harris said the officer who shot Jacob Blake based on what she had should be charged. Do you agree with her and do you believe the same for the officers who were involved in the deaths of Breonna Taylor?
BIDEN: I think we should let the judicial system work its way. I do think there is a minimum need to be charged, the officers, and as well as with Breonna Taylor.
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GOWDY: Joining us now is Karl Rove.
Mr. Rove, how are you?
KARL ROVE, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: I'm fine, Congressman. Honored to be on with you.
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GOWDY: The honor is mine.
Give us your assessment of the state of the race on September 2nd?
ROVE: You know, it's amazing to me, we -- during the Democratic National Convention, Joe Biden and the Democrats never made one mention of the violence in America's cities. We've been subjected to night after night of riots in Portland and I remember one night, the next morning, Senator Harris was attacking a witness in front of her saying, why are you attack the moms and veterans that are peacefully protesting? And we'd seen tonight where people attempted to burn down the courthouse.
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So, I -- you know, to me, it is astonishing that we've gone so long with Biden unwilling to take on the violence that we're seeing in our streets until he starts getting hit by TV ads and getting hit by the Trump campaign consistently on this issue. It begins to feels like he is fading in the polls. Only then does he give one speech in which he talks about it and immediately attempts to blame the violence on Donald Trump.
You know, we are a country of personal responsibility. Donald Trump is not responsible for people showing up and trying to fire bomb the Mark Hatfield federal court office -- courthouse in Portland, Oregon. Those people are responsible and ought to be held responsible under our rule of law.
GOWDY: Karl, if, in fact, the race is tightening what constituencies does the president need to continue to appeal to and can he do so without alienating any aspects of his base?
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ROVE: Yeah. Well, first of all, it is tightening, and we don't know exactly how much just yet, because we really do need to have polls that were conducted on Sunday, Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday of this week, so the convention is in the rear-view mirror.
But take a look at this, USA Today in June, they had a 12-point gap for Biden. They have now 7. Qunnipiac had a 15-point gap for Biden in July, now a 10-gap. Hill/Harris had 9 points just before the Democratic Convention, today plus six. Emerson had four points for Biden in July, two points today.
Now, there is one outlier. "The Economist"/YouGov had 10 before the Democratic Convention, nine after the Democratic Convention, so they actually had Biden going down one, and now it's 11 today.
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But my sense is that the polls have tightened some. But this is like World War I. Any movement is going to be very difficult and very small. But it's been good movement for the president.
Now, what does he need to do? Look, the president's base is with him. And no president ever gets elected, nobody ever gets elected president on the basis of their base only.
And so, the president has to continue to do what he did during the Republican convention and that is make an appeal for a broader group of people, for suburbanites, particularly college educated women who may like what he's doing but don't like how he's done it, by African-American voters, particularly young black males who say, you know what, when 17, 18, and 19, I actually had better prosperity than I had when Barack Obama was president and it was because of the policies of Donald Trump.
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We saw that in the spring before the coronavirus came on. And then the winner, that that feeling was there among African-American voters. And this is one that's going to grab you, Latinos. My sense is, looking at the data that I've been seeing, that the president has the ability to go from the 28 or 29 that he had in 2016, up to 24, 25, and 26. Again largely because but not exclusively because they felt they got a better economic deal when he was in office.
He's also got a variety of people in the Latino community who say, you know what, he is standing up for us. He's standing for law-abiding people who go to church, who go to work, who tried and provide for their families. And he is standing up to keep us safe.
So, you know, he got to keep doing what he started doing in the convention. I thought that was one of the reasons why it was so effective. You know, the first night Herschel Walker, the night that was anchored by your former colleague and very close friend Tim Scott and your former governor, Nikki Haley, I mean, that's exactly the kind of Republican Party that the American people need to see.
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GOWDY: Well, Karl, when I hear you say that, I think, you know, our policies may be attractive to constituencies that do not supported in the past but they're repelled by our rhetoric. Is that an oversimplification of where we are? That we just need to be better at messaging?
ROVE: Well, that's part it, but we also have to show up and we have to show up in between elections. I mean, I live in Texas. Our Republican governor was reelected last time with nearly 50 percent of the Hispanic vote.
And Republicans routinely get 50 percent of the Latino vote in Texas, why? Because our candidates make it part and parcel of their very existence to, you know, campaign in the valley, and to go to the barrio, to go to San Antonio, to meet the leadership of the Hispanic community and cultivate them.
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And that's what we've got to do as a party. It's not just a convention. It's not just a moment. But it's a lifelong commitment to show up and get involved in the community.
GOWDY: Karl, let me ask you about something that happened last night. You got to bring in a political mind, I'm going to ask you about Joe Kennedy. I can tell you when I served with him in the House, he was considered to be probably the hardest working colleague we had and that was true on both sides of the aisle. He may have been the most humble colleague and he was authentically progressive, and yet he lost.
Was this a clearing of the field by AOC for a future presidential run or is there no place for somebody like Joey Kennedy in the Democrat Party?
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ROVE: You know, Kennedy, while as liberal as he was, was probably not liberal enough. And Markey's embrace of the Green New Deal and the subsequent embrace of him by AOC sort of cemented him in the left of the Democratic Party. And in the primary, sort of the more fervent believers of the party tend to dominant, and in the Democratic primary in Massachusetts, that was the hard left and Ed Markey played to them.
As you know, he's a very affable person himself. He also had the advantage of incumbency. Think of how many years that he'd been a senator and how many mayors and city councils and local groups and interest group of people he helped over the years.
Kennedy having represented just a congressional district doesn't have that statewide base. It's hard to knock off an incumbent unless they have done something really, really wrong even if you are a Kennedy. This looked like a reach. It looked like he was a little bit too ambitious and people said we are not finished letting Ed Markey serve. You know, not your time this time, Kennedy.
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GOWDY: Karl, that's why you have on. The best -- the best political line in America.
Karl Rove, thank you.
If you like hypocrisy, you're going to absolutely love this next story. Speaker Nancy Pelosi once called for a national mask mandate. She applauded restricted lockdown measures in her home state in California, including the forced closure of countless small businesses.
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But last night, Pelosi was caught on tape inside a San Francisco hair salon, getting her hair done and, oh, about that mask mandate? Her mask was not on either. Hair salons in San Francisco have been closed since March. For you, for me, and for everyone else not named Nancy Pelosi.
But today, instead of apologizing, Nancy Pelosi blasted the salon for, quote, setting her up. Apparently, someone forced her to make an appointment and someone forced her to go the salon, and someone forced her to get her hair washed and dried. It's all a big set up. Watch.
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REP. NANCY PELOSI, D-CA, SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: I take responsibility for trusting the word of the neighborhood salon I have been to over the years many times. And that when they said we were able to accommodate people one person at a time and we can set up that time, I trusted that. As it turns out, it was a set up. So I take responsibility for falling for a set up. I think this salon owes me an apology.
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GOWDY: In a tweet, President Trump had a few choice words for the House speaker writing, quote, Crazy Nancy Pelosi is being decimated for having a beauty parlor opened when others are closed, and for not wearing a mask, despite constantly lecturing everyone else. We will almost certainly take back the House and send Nancy packing.
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Joining us now is Louisiana Senator John Kennedy.
Senator Kennedy, before we get to Speaker Pelosi, I want to first ask you about how the residents of the Louisiana are doing in the aftermath of Hurricane Laura.
SEN. JOHN KENNEDY, R-LA: Well, thank you for that, Trey.
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This is probably the worst hurricane damage I've ever seen and I've seen a lot of hurricane damage. This storm practically knocked Louisiana into Texas. I was out all day yesterday trying to help my people.
And I got in late last night and I saw the story about Speaker Pelosi violating the coronavirus rules that she has advocated for and that the rest of us mere mortals have to abide by in order to get her hair done. And I thought to myself, isn't this special?
Despite the fact it's against the law, Speaker Pelosi is getting her hair washed and probably getting a neck massage and my people don't even have water. The irony is extraordinary. But, I am not sure -- I'll be glad to explain why I make this statement -- I'm not sure she can help herself.
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GOWDY: Well, yeah, I'm going to want you to explain that one. That one is too good. Yes, why can she not help herself?
KENNEDY: Well, Speaker Pelosi is part of what I call the managerial elite. They can strut sitting down. You know who I'm talking about, Trey. The entrenched politicians in Washington, the bureaucrats, the media, the academics, the corporate phonies, they live in the condos with the high ceilings and the important art on the wall.
I call them the shaved truffles crowd. They think they're smarter and more virtuous than the middle class ordinary Americans. They're not, of course.
But here is -- here's the managerial elite -- elite's message of which Speaker Pelosi is part to the -- to the ordinary Americans. You are a bunch of morons. By the way, you are also a bunch of racists.
So, just shut up. Do what you're told and periodically, we, the managerial elite, will tell you what values and what opinions you have to adopt without debate because we are experts and we are intellectuals.
And that's why most people think now that Washington, D.C. is the place where good ideas go to die.
I'll add one more observation, just my opinion -- the managerial elite of which the speaker is a part, I know they think they are the smartest people in the room. But if they are the smartest people in the room, it's the wrong room, because if they ever get in charge, Trey, you know this, they're going to put America in the ditch. They're going to beat the crap out of America, and the American people don't deserve that.
GOWDY: Senator, one reason I think that you're popular, not only in Louisiana but also in South Carolina, is authenticity. And when I see that video, I see hypocrisy -- the same with the mayor of Chicago telling folks they can protest but not in her neighborhood, the same with elected officials who say you can't eat indoors but I'm going to.
Is there going to be a political price to be paid for hypocrisy?
KENNEDY: Well, Trey, you -- you make a good point. And I don't want to paint with too broad of a brush. All Democrats are not like -- all Democrats are not like this, but too many Democrats today, they -- they don't like ordinary Americans unless they're part of a specific minority group that they deem worthy.
And for most ordinary Americans, the members of the managerial elite of which Speaker Pelosi is a part and I think Vice President Biden is too, they -- they just think that we're all a bunch of deplorables if we're not part of a specific group that they deem worthy. And they don't respect the opinions of ordinary Americans and they don't like us very much.
And I don't think Americans want to be governed by people who look down on them. I know I don't.
GOWDY: Senator, you had a distinguished career in the law before you joined the United States Senate. What did you think of her "I was set up" defense? And why is it so hard for people in politics sometimes to just say, I'm sorry, I was wrong? Why do you have to say "I was set up"?
KENNEDY: Well, the speaker makes my point. She thinks most Americans are morons and are going to believe that.
You know, when people, ordinary Americans lie to Congress, you can go to jail. When members of Congress lie to the American people, it's called -- it's just politics.
And that's -- that's what the speaker has done. She knows that's not accurate. She just got caught but she actually expects the American people to believe that excuse.
GOWDY: Well, my experience has been the American people will forgive you for almost anything except lying.
We've got about 30 seconds left. What can people that love your state but don't live there do to help you in the coming days and weeks?
KENNEDY: You can go to my website, Kennedy.Senate.gov. There are a number of ways you can help in terms of sending food, sending prayers, sending charitable contributions.
We'll get through this. Americans -- Louisianans and Americans are tough as a boot. We will -- we will show the American people what it's like to be an American. We understand Louisiana, that getting, you know, knocked down is not failure. Failure is not getting up. We'll get back up.
GOWDY: Thank you, Senator. God bless you and everyone else in Louisiana. Thank you.
Some breaking news we are monitoring tonight. An officer involved shooting in Washington,, D.C. and now, there's a Black Lives Matter protest at the Seventh District precinct at our nation's capital. We'll bring you the updates on this story throughout the hour.
When we come back right back, tensions continue to rise between the United States and the Chinese Communist Party. The president's top diplomat, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo will be here to tell us what President Trump's next move is.
Stay with us.
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GOWDY: Welcome back to this special edition of "Hannity."
On the heels this historic peace deal between the United Arab Emirates and Israel, the Trump administration has been working overtime to protect American interest in the Middle East and around the world.
In Asia, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo is cracking down on the Communist Party of China, starting with placing restrictions on diplomats here on U.S. soil. Pompeo's goal is to level the playing field and respond to the restraints China already has in place on Americans.
This comes as tensions with China seem to be reaching a fever pitch. Yesterday, the Pentagon reported China's plans to double their nuclear stockpile in the next 10 years. And today, during an interview, Attorney General Bill Barr issued this warning. Listen.
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WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Of those three countries that the intelligence community has pointed out to, Russia, China and Iran, which is the most assertive, the most aggressive in this area?
WILLIAM BARR, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: I believe it's China.
BLITZER: Which one?
BARR: China.
BLITZER: China more than Russia right now?
BARR: Yes.
BLITZER: Why do you say that?
BARR: Because I've seen the intelligence. That's what I've concluded.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOWDY: Joining us now with more is United States Secretary of State Mike Pompeo.
Mr. Secretary, thank you for joining us.
MIKE POMPEO, SECRETARY OF STATE: Congressman Gowdy, it's great to be with you.
GOWDY: Likewise.
Tell us about the actions you've taken against China with respect to their diplomats and why you took it?
POMPEO: Trey, today, we took the simple action of telling Chinese diplomats working here in the United States that the free ride is over. Their ability to conduct espionage here in the United States, the time has passed. And so, we put restrictions on them.
They need permission now to conduct meetings with local officials and to gather certain at levels. This is the kind of restrictions we had on us, our diplomats in China. And now, we've got a reciprocal arrangement.
It's the same thing President Trump has done in every dimension. For 40 years, Trey, the United States took a knee and bent a knee to the Chinese communist party, and President Trump has said enough, whether it's on trade or on their stealing intellectual property and trade secrets, destroying jobs here in the United States.
We're simply not going to take it anymore. We're going to demand that the Chinese Communist Party, that authoritarian regime, not treat America in the way that it has for all these decades.
GOWDY: Well, Mr. Secretary, before you were the secretary of state, you were the head of the CIA and you were also on the House Intelligence Committee when you served in the House.
Do you view China as our country's greatest threat? Is it on par with Russia or ahead of Russia?
POMPEO: Trey, the single greatest threat to the United States of America from a foreign power emanates from the Chinese Communist Party. It's not frankly a close call.
I heard the attorney general's comments today about particular threat related to elections. But broader and more deeply than that, the Chinese Communist Party is building its military. It has infiltrated the United States in ways that Russia has not and its economic might has been used through state-owned enterprises and subsidized companies to destroy tens of thousands of jobs all across the heartland in America.
It's unacceptable behavior and President Trump is not going to permit it to continue.
And then, of course, we're all suffering even today from the Wuhan virus -- the Chinese Communist Party had a chance to slow it down, to stop it, to let the world know what was taking place. And instead of giving us full disclosure, they covered it up.
And this is thousands of lives and billions of dollars and wealth destroyed in the United States and all across the world. This is what authoritarian regimes do. It's what President Trump is making sure they can never do again to America.
GOWDY: Mr. Secretary, you mentioned China as a military threat. What are they doing to increase their military capacity? And what should Americans know about that and be concerned about?
POMPEO: Well, they have increased their budget significantly. It's permitted them to conduct an enormous amount of missile tests, increasing risks throughout Southeast Asia. They are building up their navy. They're professionalizing their military, truly building up a capacity, not just to be effective in their coastal waters but to create power that can reach all across the globe.
And then they are co-opting other countries. They're using their military power to build bases around the world as well.
This has been going on for far too long. We're going to turn the tide. The world has begun to see.
This is -- Trey, this is about the central ideas of freedom versus authoritarianism. America knows how to win these confrontations and with President Trump's leadership, I'm very confident that we will. We have spent more money on our military over the last two years than any year in the previous decades.
You and I served in Congress together. We saw the struggle we had to do that. President Trump is -- he's going to build out our military, he's going to take care of our soldiers, our sailor, our airmen, and marines. We'll be ready.
GOWDY: Mike, you recently took some action with respect to the ICC, the International Criminal Court. Why did you take that action and why was that in America's best interest?
POMPEO: You know, Trey, I think most Americans aren't familiar with the International Criminal Court. This is a group of political hacks in The Hague, a place that is threatening our kids who served in Afghanistan, our young men and women who served and fought there.
This is a rogue court with lawyers that are frankly corrupt and political. And they are threatening to prosecute Americans who engage in America's fight for freedom in Afghanistan. It's unacceptable.
And so, we have begun to put pressure on the court, to tell the court just -- the United States did not participate in the agreements that set up this court. We want nothing to do with and you are darn sure not going to prosecute Americans.
So, we today sanctioned a couple of the people who are at the center of the effort to prosecute Americans. We won't rest until it's a case that we are confident that no mother, no father has to worry about their child traveling across the world might be held by this court in The Hague.
GOWDY: Mike, there was a historic agreement between the UAE and Israel. What should Americans know about that? And what's Iran been doing since we have not heard as much about them as Russia and China lately?
POMPEO: You know, Trey, it was truly historic to watch and in fact listen to the conversation between Prime Minister Netanyahu and the leader of the United Arab Emirates Crown Prince Mohammed Bin Sayed, and President Trump. A historic peace agreement where he had this long history of the Arab states not recognizing Israel as the Jewish homeland and as it ought to be, a nation that has a right to exist.
President Trump, his vision for peace is beginning come to fruition. We've now seen the first country in two and a half decades recognize Israel's right to exist, and you can already see the benefits to both the people of Israel and the people of the United Arab Emirates. Part -- it came in part because of the president's decision early on, he recognized that the Islamic Republic of Iran was the greatest threat to stability in the Middle East, the greatest risk to our kids, our men and women, and our safety here in the United States.
The United Arab Emirates and Israel both recognized Iran as this great threat. So, they've now found a way to build out a relationship which can build a coalition to ultimately make sure that this threat never reaches American shores or harms anyone in the Middle East either.
GOWDY: Secretary Pompeo, thank you for your service to our country, including your service in uniform when you finished at West Point.
A tense situation developing in Washington, D.C. where protestors are gathering because of a police involved shooting in the southwest neighborhood earlier today.
Joining us now with a full report is Fox News's Rich Edson.
RICH EDSON, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Good evening, Congressman.
And is a situation that is just developing here in Washington, D.C. in front of one of the police stations in town. This is just a few hours after a shooting in southeast D.C. What we're hearing from folks on the scene is that there was a loud exchange between Black Lives Matter protesters at the Seventh District police station here in southeast D.C. That there's probably about a hundred or so people gathered. They are chanting "Black Lives Matter". Police formed a barricade in front of the station to try to prevent people from getting in.
The origination of this protest all started with a shooting around 3:50 this afternoon according to the police. The police gave a news conference as short while ago. The police chief did, and said that this all started with officers responding to a vehicle. People fled on foot, an officer shot his weapon. A male was taken to the hospital and pronounced dead and police say that two guns were recovered.
The police are stressing that this is a preliminary investigation right now. Reporters asked the D.C. police chief, Peter Newsham, who was giving this news conference, why did the officer shoot? Newsham reported that given the circumstances, we will not speculate. We need to complete our investigation.
So, the details are still very thin on this. We don't know all this much about specifically what happened at the scene earlier this afternoon in Washington that led to a shooting of a male in southeastern D.C. Protestors are gathering. You are seeing a lot of activity on Twitter over the last few hours, right now, calling for people to protest, to gather at this police station.
And this is now all unfolding in southeast D.C. in front of the precinct there in D.C. -- Congressman.
GOWDY: Thank you, Rich.
Coming up, the lawlessness in America's Democrat-run cities continues.
Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler says he will soon move out of his home after an angry group of rioters showed up at his apartment building and lit things on fire. I think I'd move too or get a new mayor. Pete Hegseth and Leo Terrell are up next.
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GOWDY: Welcome back to "Hannity."
Lawlessness in some of America's most liberal cities continues. And we have some disturbing updates tonight.
Seattle Police discovered spike strips and weapons inside the tents located in the former CHOP zone.
Meanwhile, Chicago police released surveillance footage of dozens of looters from an incident on May 31st. Now, they're asking the public to help identify the suspects.
And in Portland, Mayor Ted Wheeler announced he will move out of his condo. If you recall, on Monday, rioters gathered outside his building, set fire to a park bench, broke some windows and launched fireworks.
This comes as one Portland store owner tells Fox News, quote, we can't hold on much longer, amid the protests.
So, where are the rioters coming from? The evidence indicates it's not just locals descending on American cities but out-of-staters are joining as well.
As the rioting and unrest continue, President Trump today ordered the federal government to begin the process of defunding of New York City, Seattle, Portland, Washington, D.C., where protestors are outside of a police station tonight after an officer involved shooting.
Here with more reaction, civil rights attorney Leo Terrell and "Fox and Friends" weekend co-host Pete Hegseth.
Welcome, gentlemen, to both of you.
PETE HEGSETH, "FOX AND FRIENDS” WEEKEND CO-HOST: Thank you.
LEO TERRELL, CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Thank you. Welcome. Thank you.
GOWDY: Mr. Terrell, you're a lawyer. I want you to help the viewers understand why judges tell the jury you must wait until the last witness has testified and the last piece of evidence has been put in before you -- before you can reach a conclusion. Why not do that in investigations too?
TERRELL: Well, Trey, it's very simple. You want all of the facts. You want all the evidence for the jury to make an informed decision. But what you see right now is a strategy of these extremists.
Whenever there is a shooting, regarding of the fact, they're not important, go protest, burn, destroy. And what is sad, Trey, is that these individuals are getting protection from Democratic mayors and they hate the Democratic mayors. They don't like them.
That's what is happening in Portland. It's crazy. They make deals with these extremists, Antifa, Black Lives Matter, and they don't get the respect.
Here's the part that's also ridiculous, Joe Biden, because of polling pressure is now reacting to it. Joe Biden hasn't acknowledged the injured police officers. He hasn't acknowledged the black on black crime. He can't even say the word Antifa because they are beholden to these extremist groups.
So, what's going to happen is, you're going to have this constant, whenever there's an incident, all these extremists are going to come out and protest without knowing any of the facts. It is outright ludicrous. It's crazy. It's chaotic.
TERRELL: Well, he also wants to be the chief law enforcement officer for the country and he's already made up his mind in Kenosha. He's already decided that charges should be leveled even though the investigation is ongoing.
Pete, you've got -- you've got strip spikes. You've got weapons. You've got looting in Chicago. You have the FBI warning police officers that they may be targeted for shootings. What happened to the peaceful protest?
HEGSETH: You know better than I do, Trey, the First Amendment affords the right to peaceful -- peaceably assembly. That's not what we're talking about here and that's what Democrat mayors and governors cannot figure out. In the face of a mob, who is breaking every rule, every law that you can -- every other citizen follows, the only choice you have is to enforce that law.
Ted Wheeler says, I'm moving out. The first thing the mayor should say is, everybody who lives in my building and in my neighborhood deserves to live in a peaceful environment. So, the minute you throw a rock, a bottle, you start a fire, you are committing a crime in my community, and the police will be emboldened to do something about it.
Instead, from Joe Biden, all the way down the Democrat Party, they won't condemn Antifa. They won't condemn the violent aspects of Black Lives Matter, and they will not empower -- I just almost said empower the police, which would make it seem like they are pro-police. They are throwing the police under the bus who are supposed to be doing the work to protect the communities.
And they are trying to blame Donald Trump. That's the most insidious part about this. He's backed the police. He said, I'll give you what you need. I'll give you federal support. I'll give you the National Guard, because, ultimately, in order for peaceably assembly to exist, the people -- the law breakers have to be held accountable.
I've been on the riot line, Trey. I've been on the riot line with the National Guard in Washington, D.C., during riots. If you give ground, they take more. They would have gone all the way to the White House. They said with bullhorns, we're going to burn it down.
Ted Wheeler's house, baby mayor in Minneapolis, Jacob Frey, who gave up the police precinct, he got booed out of these things. They can never satisfy the mob because they don't empower law enforcement. It only gets worse. We are not talking about cracking down on protestors. It's so easy, Trey. You break a law, you are held accountable for it. The Democrats cannot figure that out.
GOWDY: Mr. Terrell, we got about 30 seconds. It looks like the Vice President Biden has pivoted towards more of a law and order message. Is it too late? And what do you think precipitated that shift that we saw yesterday and today?
TERRELL: Well, Trey, let me answer your first question, that tough one. Is it too late? Yes!
He lost the law and order arguments to President Trump. The whole purpose of the shift is that they honestly thought they could allow Democratic cities to burn and they could still win the White House. The American public gets it.
They allow -- the Democrat allowed criminals to run the cities. Cities are in flames. People throughout the city suburbs, everyone should be aware of these criminals. And it's too late for them to change course. Donald Trump is going to on the law and order argument. He's going to win in November.
Pete Hegseth, Leo Terrell, thank you.
Coming up, Joe Biden continues to change positions on some of the post pressing issues our country faces. Now, he's trying to decide whether he supports a national mask mandate. It's Biden versus Biden. We'll explain.
Congressman Devin Nunes and Congresswoman Elise Stefanik join us next.
Plus, we are monitoring the protests in Washington, D.C. after an officer involved shooting. We will have a live report coming up next on the ground.
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GOWDY: This is a Fox News alert. Protestors are gathering outside of a police station in our nation's capitol after an officer involved shooting earlier today.
Joining us now live from Washington, D.C. is WTTG's Evan Lambert -- Evan.
EVAN LAMBERT, WTTG REPORTER: So, right now, you see there is a group of protestors about 100 or so that really are alternating different chants. They're saying Black Lives Matter. They're saying we want answers and they're standing really just inches from police officers there at the front of the 7th district headquarters here in D.C.
You can hear some of the chants. Earlier, we saw that there were some protests at the scene of this shooting. Police telling us that an officer fired a shot at an 18-year-old young man and that man later died.
They also are chanting that man's name as well. Not a whole lot of information at this point about what caused that officer to fire. But police did tell us that they recovered two guns from the area. They also say that they believe that that subject who was shot and killed was armed.
I talked to an aunt of that person, that man, who says that they do not believe that. And we should learn some -- more about this really in a few days because there is a new law in effect that says body camera video of these incidents here in D.C. comes out within five days.
But right now, you can see that people here are gathered. They want answers. They want to know why this man was shot and killed. And obviously, it's reflective of what has happened around the country, around -- in Minneapolis, in Kenosha as well. And these people are demanding answers from police. And we hope to learn a lot more.
Back to you.
GOWDY: Evan, thank you.
Joe Biden continues to have a hard time deciding what he believes even on major policy issues confronting the country. Just weeks ago, Joe Biden and Kamala Harris were strongly pushing for a so-called national mask mandate.
But Biden isn't he agrees with Biden now. Listen to this.
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JOE BIDEN, DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: I'm a constitutionalist. You know, you can't do things the Constitution doesn't allow you the power to do. What I would be doing is putting as much pressure as I could on every governor, every senator -- I mean, excuse me, every mayor and every county executive, every local official and everyone in business, putting pressure on them, to say what you're doing is irresponsible. Make sure you wear a mask and maintain social distancing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOWDY: Biden's inability to make up his mind on important issues, couple with Speaker Pelosi's refusal to negotiate on coronavirus relief, she's now blaming, quote, serious differences with the White House for a bill still being stalled in the House.
Joining us now for reaction is the author of "Countdown to Socialism", House Intelligence Committee ranking member, Devin Nunes, and Congresswoman Elise Stefanik from New York.
Devin, I will start with you.
I have no idea whether the vice president supports a mask mandate or does not, whether he's going to lock the country down or he is not. It can't be due to a lack of time in Congress because he was there for 47 years. Do you know what he believes?
REP. DEVIN NUNES, R-CA: Well, Trey, I'm actually a little disappointed because that was one part of the Democratic platform that I actually understood, other than wanting to defund the police and tear down the Washington Monument, and tear down statues and allow riots to occur all over the country, the one thing I did understand was Biden was for a mask mandate.
But, you know, now, today, or just recently, we now have salon-gate here in the state of California where the speaker of the House I guess assumed that she wasn't abiding by Biden's mask mandate either.
GOWDY: Yes, Elise, I want to ask about the coronavirus relief. But I sat by you for two years on the floor of the House and you are one of the wisest people I know and you're also a fair person.
What do you make of what happened with Nancy Pelosi in California? And is the criticism fair for having a different set of rules for everyone else from herself?
REP. ELISE STEFANIK, R-NY: Absolutely, the criticism is fair. You know, when I first ran for Congress, Trey, I think one of the biggest promises you make to constituents and the American people is that members of Congress and elected officials live by the same laws as everyone else. And this is a classic example that we saw from Nancy Pelosi, at the height of hypocrisy, of do as I say, not as I do.
And what is particularly shameful is she is blaming it on a set up, blaming the small business owner. I know as small businesses have suffered over the course of COVID crisis, I spoke directly to many salon owners in my district. So, I was well-aware of what the rules are. That's part of your job as a policy maker.
So, again, this is the height of hypocrisy we're seeing from Speaker Pelosi. She should apologize to the small business owner and she should work to ensure that we can safely open these small businesses. Again, it's very disappointing to see, and there's going to be accountability as the American people see this.
GOWDY: Well, I want to get your perspective on that because I do consider you to be a fair person. Now, I'm going to, in fairness to you, will go back to what I wanted to talk to you about, which is the coronavirus relief package and why it's been stalled and what needs to be done to move it forward.
STEFANIK: Well, make no mistake. Speaker Pelosi walked away from three different offers that the Republican Senate put forward, that provided relief to small businesses, that provided direct funding to K-12 schools, to ensure that they can safely reopen. She chose to walk away from that package.
We need to come together and compromise. The White House has over and over and over again reached out to her. We are in a divided government right now and Nancy Pelosi needs to put aside her partisan politics and really ensure that comes to the table and not -- and really doesn't hold the American people and small businesses hostage.
GOWDY: Ranking Member Nunes, one of your committee members, John Ratcliffe, is now the DNI and he this week announced that he was going to suspend in-person briefings. Adam Schiff and others were apoplectic about that.
Can you shed some light for viewers on what that decision was and what John's impetus behind that may have been?
NUNES: Well, Trey, I think you can also answer that question because you were with us as leaks occur on a daily basis.
So, this is long overdue. There's -- we gain nothing from these briefers. What they always try to do is set up these briefers.
A lot of these people are professionals. They've been out in the war zones. They come back into Washington and to Congress.
And what the Democrats do is they play gotcha and then they run upstairs and they talk to their friends in the media. And it's leaking of classified information. And it's continued on and on, and it's always for one thing, and that is to build whatever false narrative they're building for that day or week. And we all know how that ended with this Russian collusion hoax where they've essentially decimated the FBI and the Department of Justice.
GOWDY: We've only got about 20 seconds, Elise.
My understanding is that you are still getting the intelligence. You're just not getting it in the form that can be leaked. Is that -- is that fair? You're still -- you're on an oversight committee over Ratcliffe.
STEFANIK: Absolutely.
Absolutely. We're getting written briefings. But we don't want to see the illegal leaks that we've seen for four years now from Adam Schiff and Democrats on the committee. So, I support DNI Ratcliffe's decision.
GOWDY: Thank you, Elise. Thank you.
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GOWDY: Welcome back to "Hannity."
That is all the time we have left this evening. Before we go, my new book "Doesn't Hurt to Ask" is out now. It will help you win your next conversation, survive Thanksgiving lunch and ask all the right questions. I hope you will take a look.
Thanks for joining us tonight.
Raymond Arroyo is filling in for Laura Ingraham.
Raymond, I hope you have a great show.
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