This is a rush transcript from "The Five," April 22, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Hi, I'm Greg Gutfeld with Emily Compagno, Juan Williams, Jesse Watters, and a flowerpot is her hot tub, Dana Perino -- "The Five."

Islamic terrorists killed hundreds in Sri Lanka on Easter Sunday. But what's key beyond the horror was that the targeted country was aware of the threat. And this nugget from USA Today, quote, the country's prime minister and his cabinet were unaware of the intelligence until after the attacks due to political dysfunction -- political dysfunction, which is really code for deadly incompetence and taking your eye off the ball.

It's something to remember, as our media invites us to chase phantoms of their own making, loss and fever dreams over collusion, obstruction, impeachment, hate hoaxes, Stormy and Avenatti, is that real evil still stalks this planet, and terror is liquid always seeking the path of least resistance. And that path is often carved by our own distraction sparked by those who see politics as far more important than our safety, which is why terror couldn't compete with the Mueller report even on Easter.

Nothing matters except winning that news cycle. But, hey, it happened far away. And in America, it's a peaceful time but only because there are people you don't know making sure it's still peaceful, until one day when terror strikes as at home, as it has before. We can't forget that America is terror target number one and that our number one priority isn't impeachment but security, our borders, grid, landmarks, water -- food supply. Everything is up for grabs in a time where terror has smartphones too. And when something big finally strikes winning a news cycle looks more than petty, it's downright dangerous.

Emily, we've talked about this before. Al Qaeda can come and go. ISIS can be disappeared. But there will always be an ideology, and an ideology will always give birth to something new, I think?

EMILY COMPAGNO, GUEST CO-HOST: I agree. We've also talked about it in the context of -- that their needs to be some type of detailed and planned leveled so that the global messaging that's happening with Islamic terrorism and those kinds of fundamentalists, we need to address that.

And I agree with you that when you hoard information and when you have political infighting that prevents you from sharing that information, that cost lives. And we are on a dangerous trajectory as well, not to be a fear monger but we are as well. If this is the ball that some people are focused on, it should be security first, 100 percent. But I think, yes, that the messaging is important because that's traveling around the world.

GUTFELD: Dana, they had, I guess, two week's advanced warning? Did they not take it seriously or was it just something that just got lost?

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: They'll have to find out. I mean, but what a way to figure it out, afterwards.

GUTFELD: Yeah.

PERINO: Secretary Pompeo was quite gracious today, actually, to the Sri Lankans, saying that we will help, we will provide all this. But we have been helping and we help all of these countries. And maybe they don't get enough foreign aid as they would like, but they have to do something for us too. They have to be willing to share the information with each other or at least with us.

GUTFELD: Right.

PERINO: Because -- I got the statistics today from the brain room, since 2012, 23,177 Christians have been killed for faith-related reasons, 23,000. That is abhorrent. It is unacceptable. And if we're going to provide aid and were going to provide intelligence services, sharing, maybe military gear, whatever it is that they need, the least they can do is pass it up the chain that there was going to be an attack, it could have been prevented.

GUTFELD: Juan, there were eight coordinated detonations. This is a group that we've never heard of, but it's kind of the same thing, right? I mean, it's just mutates, changes, evolves, gets better.

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Right. So this is the argument that we have, you know. Before I start that, let me just say, so the kids that died, there's a kid -- a fifth grader from -- in D.C. There were three of the four children of a Danish billionaire --

GUTFELD: Right.

WILLIAMS: -- who's the biggest landowner in Britain. And I just can't imagine the depth of his sadness. Japanese people were killed. So this was a worldwide event in that sense. It touched us all. And I think it's important to also keep in mind, and we see it here in the U.S., more security in our churches in the aftermath of this.

And there were some suspicions going back to Notre Dame in Paris. Luckily, apparently, that's just -- that was an accident. But I will say this, when you hear people say, oh, ISIS is defeated. I worry about it -- why I worry? Because people who I think, well, then we don't have a threat, but we do have a threat.

We have a threat, as you described it -- I think you've said, you know, water goes wherever there's an opening.

COMPAGNO: Right.

WILLIAMS: So what we see is that this ideology now shifts. And we've never heard of this group. All of a sudden here they pop up and they're bombing a church in Sri Lanka, and they're going after Christians. So to me, this is a generational fight. The ideology, unfortunately, is not defeated. And we as Americans cannot lose sight of the fact that we're in an ongoing fight.

And when the president boasts for whatever reason that ISIS is defeated, don't be fooled. We've got to keep up not only the attention but the fight. And with regard to the intelligence, we know there's all sorts of arguments about, did we know what was coming on 9/11. You know what? You can blame and you can say they're incompetent, they're not the U.S. government, not U.S. intelligence, not Israeli intelligence, they're not British, but the fact is the people responsible are the terrorists.

PERINO: Can I clarify that, though? I mean, because after 9/11 is when we took down the wall between intelligence and law enforcement. That made a big difference. Then we stepped up efforts all around the world to make sure that those governments where you knew there were hot spots would have what they needed in order to share -- to have the information, to have the equipment that they need. We have -- we've learned a lesson --

WILLIAMS: Correct.

PERINO: -- from 9/11. And if we're going to help these countries, the least they can do is they had the information. They just didn't pass it on.

WILLIAMS: Correct. But so -- I mean, I think that we have made changes and we have adapted post-9/11. But I just don't like the idea that we would say, well, it's their failure -- people did that to us. I didn't like it. I didn't think it was fair to us, to our government. I think the terrorists are the ones who should be held responsible.

GUTFELD: So, Jesse, we've seen different responses to this. Some are pretty odd.

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Yeah.

GUTFELD: Would you care to pick the ones that disgust you most or --

WATTERS: Well, I have the Washington Post right here and it's just kind of disgusting, Christianity under attack? Sri Lanka church bombings stoke far right anger in the west. And it's a whole article, not about editorializing about radical Islam, murdering people. It's editorializing and saying, oh, Christians are upset that churches are being bombed. And they're making Christians and conservatives out to be the villains for reacting to terrorist attacks.

Look at some of the leading Democrats, how they characterize it. They didn't use Christians. They didn't say a lot of churches. They've actually said Easter worshipers were under attack. Now, you don't say -- you don't call Muslims Ramadan-worshipers. You don't call Jews pass-over worshipers. It's a made-up phrase. And I think why did they make up phrases like this?

And this is one of the reasons why people don't trust liberals because they're not in touch with reality. They do this because they're pandering to Muslims because a lot of liberals feel that they are so obsessed with how other people think about them. And if they're thought up to be insensitive, that drives them crazy.

And second of all, they think their own rhetoric causes Islamic extremism. And remember, blame America first? They think Islamophobia causes radical Islam, so they do whatever they can to sanitize it. Now BuzzFeed actually came out, one of their editors, and said, wow, President Trump, imagine how outraged he'd be if whites were the victims of the Sri Lanka attack.

And I just find that completely despicable to play the race card after a terrorist attack. It's what they did in Katrina. Remember, Bush? Oh, he would have acted faster if there were white victims in Louisiana. And when I step back and think about, conservatives are pretty color-blind when it comes to life. They don't talk about the different races, babies in the wombs. They want to protect all life.

And it's a lot of conservatives in the media who talk about stopping the carnage in the south side of Chicago. So I think it's really unfair when the media always -- no matter who does it, if it's a white perpetrator, Muslim perpetrator, Hispanic perpetrator, they just take the violence and they tried to turn it against the president or his supporters and I think it's really -- it's shameful.

GUTFELD: All right. Well, let's move on, shall we? President Trump smacking down Democrats' impeachment talk after the Mueller report. Hear from him next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WILLIAMS: At this moment, Democrats convening on a conference call to figure what their next move will be post-Mueller report. Some in the party is saying impeachment proceedings could be coming against President Trump following Mueller's findings.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's certainly the case that impeachment would be unsuccessful if the Republican Party continues to place party above country.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You can see that there's enough information there not only on obstruction of justice but also on collusion or conspiracy, whatever you want to call it, to move forward with impeachment on this president.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have called on the House to initiate impeachment proceedings.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIAMS: President Trump mocking this move on twitter. Here he says, quote, only high crimes and misdemeanors can lead to impeachment. No crimes by me, collusion, no obstruction, so you can't impeach. It was the Democrats that committed the crimes, not your Republican president. Tables are finally turning on the witch hunt. Trump also dismissing the Mueller report and impeachment threats earlier.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are you worried that your staff is ignoring your orders, like the Mueller report portrays?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Nobody disobeys my orders.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are you worried about impeachment, Mr. President?

TRUMP: Not even a little bit.

(END VIDEO CLIP) WILLIAMS: All right. So, Dana, let's go to the reality here. What are the odds that this conference call, Nancy Pelosi is holding as we --

PERINO: It's happening right now, right? The most publicized conference call. You can bet there's 20 reporters on the call --

WILLIAMS: One argument would be, Dana, it's the accountability. It's Lawrence Tribe, by the way, and other say, you know what, Congress has a responsibility to hold the president accountable. The other argument is, ah, it's only like 18 months until the next election and there's a danger that you just energized Trump's base because Trump will say, oh, these Democrats are trying to toss me out. Where you --

PERINO: Well, I think that the Democrats by their own admission have a habit of dividing into hostile camps, or as President Obama helpfully reminders us that a circular firing squad is where you turn your guns on each other. So on the one side you have the very cautious and like the old guard, the establishment saying, whoa, we remember what happened to the Republicans when they did this to Clinton. That the Republicans have egg on their face.

You have former Speaker Newt Gingrich saying looking back on it might have not of been the best thing to pursue. Then you have the firebrands saying you don't understand that we want this. There was a little-bit of a -- it's survey monkey. It's not an official poll. But they've polled just Democrats, 800 Democrats. What do you think?

Well, 51 percent of those saying -- who are very liberals say we want impeachment. Thirty one percent say it is worth the Democrats time to at least pursue. I think what could happen here is that you will get hearings and you'll have ongoing things in the walk right up to the line of impeachment and it will be like -- it will be harassment. It would be considered harassment from the president's perspective.

But they won't quite actually go to impeachment because they know it won't pass in the Senate. The other thing I would point out is that -- in the commercial break we just saw that the House judiciary committee has just subpoenaed Don McGahn, the president's former lawyer who was at the question of the obstruction piece which probably prevented obstruction charge against the president.

WILLIAMS: So, Jesse, Mueller is going to have to testify at some point. And, of course, as Dana point out, you have several congressional committees launching their own investigations. So at that point, is impeachment simply redundant?

WATTERS: I don't know, Juan. I can't believe you just crashed survey monkey like that.

PERINO: Well, no, it's because -- this because our official polling group, which is very good at foxnews.com -- we don't put them online.

WATTERS: I'm a big survey monkey fan, by the way. Also, Juan, don't cite Laurence Tribe anymore. I mean, he was out there for two years saying there's collusion. He probably got it more wrong than anybody else besides Adam Schiff. Also, Maxine Waters, no relation, that might have been one of the dumbest thing she's ever said. Can you believe what she just said? Let's go impeach Trump for collusion.

Did she not read the Mueller report? There's no collusion and she wants to impeach for collusion. Juan, how could you not notice that? I mean, that's the dumbest thing she's ever said. Said a lot of dumb things. Also --

WILLIAMS: I'll let you argue it.

WATTERS: President Trump survived the coup and the Democrats are freaking out because they thought this Mueller report was going to deliver the goods and it didn't. He's got a fat war chest. He's got a hot economy. And the Democrats have all these dozens of people running around -- running for president and they're all crazy.

They know they can't win at the ballot box so they have to impeach. And now the media wants them to impeach because they feel like they have to justify the hoax that they perpetrated for two years.

WILLIAMS: The media you think wants them --

WATTERS: Yeah, they've been begging for the Democrats to impeach.

WILLIAMS: But, Emily, I think that Nancy Pelosi has been very clear that given that the Senate is in Republicans hands and there's been no real departure of Republicans from President Trump, you know, she just not -- she doesn't see the benefit -- in impeachment. That's comes not only from Nancy Pelosi but House leadership, and with the exception of Elizabeth Warren, all the Democrats running for president.

COMPAGNO: Pelosi and some of them have been cleared in that regard, yes, but plenty have not and are totally furthering the impeachment flag on the left. I mean, the two things strike me about this. Number one, when Adam Schiff says, you know, is it in the best interest of the country to pursue impeachment? Like, maybe -- maybe it's yes. Absolutely not.

The colossal effort being undertaken right now by the House in terms of all the collaboration, the finance committee, intelligence, ways and means, 100-plus subpoenas out there, each or most of them, I should say, require votes of those committees to do so. They're subpoenaing the U.S. Treasury Department, Deutsche Bank, etcetera. All of that -- what are they not doing because of that? They're not legislating.

So all of that effort is taken away from what we elected them to do. And when we talk about impeachment, it's not just the expected $2 million but all of those man-hours that again will detract from what I would love to see would be how about you guys work on building bridges for the next two years rather than continuing to burn them.

WATTERS: Or walls. The walls --

PERINO: Infrastructure week.

COMPAGNO: Yes. And the second --

WATTERS: Is it this week or was it last week?

PERINO: Every week.

COMPAGNO: Every week is infrastructure week. And the second point is that -- I think it's interesting that President Trump went to the courts right now and to block the subpoena to (INAUDIBLE) accounting firm because that kind of undermines the power of the legislative branch. Because it's basically saying the court order matters more.

And I won't get down the rabbit hole of what happened with Eric Holder and fast and furious, but we saw what happened with the criminal and civil contempt. What happens when those are issued? Bottom line, absolutely nothing. What are we going to do? Arrest him and prosecute him? The DOJ would do so. It's impossible to -- oh, I'm done.

(LAUGHTER) WILLIAMS: I'm glad you got it out. Let it all out.

GUTFELD: What she said?

WILLIAMS: We want Greg to talk.

GUTFELD: No, no, no. I want to hear everything she said, but I want it at half speed because it just went flying right over my head. I swear to God. You know what? You know what I'm tired of, first? I'm tired of the collusion drama queens. These are the people that are always tweeting like, I'm sickened. I'm literally shaking. No, you're not. You're not literally -- people literally shaking or like when they're mugged, or when they hear terrible news. They're not sickened or literally shaking.

The best analogy is from Glenn Reynolds in USA Today. He compares the last holdouts of collusion to a doomsday cult. Do you know what a doomsday cult where they set the apocalypse date and they get it wrong so they just move it? That's a brilliant analogy. I'm stealing it from him. But what we're seeing is the arbitrary nation of the weapons being used to get rid of Trump, because they didn't get collusion, they're moving to obstruction. It really doesn't matter.

And to your point, it really is a coup. It's a slow-motion coup. They're undoing the will of the people. Just win, baby, as Al Davis would say. Just win, and then you don't have to undo the will of the people, because if you undo the will of the people you're going to have some really angry people who are going to come after you.

And I'm not saying it's going to be violent. I'm just saying -- people know when you're stealing from them and this would be a stolen election when you've got plenty of time to win, baby.

WILLIAMS: All right. So I have one last thing for all of you. If Bill Clinton -- when Bill Clinton was impeached, Republican said, yeah, he lied, he might not -- but he's a liar. He's dishonest. He was ordering people to do things that are wrong. And so if you apply the same standard --

GUTFELD: We've evolved since then, Juan. We've evolved. I've evolved.

WILLIAMS: All right, all right. All right, MSNBC under fire for ambushing Robert Mueller outside his church on Easter Sunday. That video is next right here on THE FIVE for you to see.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WATTERS: Want to know how the mainstream media spent Easter Sunday? Check out this despicable video of an MSNBC reporter ambushing Special Counsel Robert Mueller outside of his church.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sir, can I ask you a couple of question? Will you testify before Congress, sir?

ROBERT MUELLER, SPECIAL COUNSEL: No comment.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you sure about that, sir? If he were anybody but the president, would Mr. Trump be indicted, sir?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now that you've finished --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sir, why didn't you make a recommendation to Congress one way or the other, sir?

MUELLER: Are you on vacation --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The attorney general accurately characterized your positions on conspiracy and obstruction, sir?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's accurate to characterize Director Mueller today as being tight-lipped in response to my questions, Joy.

(END VIDEO CLIP) WATTERS: Even I --

(LAUGHTER)

WATTERS: -- would not ambush someone coming out of church on Easter Sunday.

GUTFELD: Are you sure?

(LAUGHTER)

WATTERS: I'll tell you what? We didn't have a lot of rules when I did those ambushes, maybe few. One of those rules was you don't ever ambush anybody on a religious holiday.

GUTFELD: But see that's bigoted, because then atheists don't have any protection.

WATTERS: Sorry.

GUTFELD: That's not fair.

WATTERS: Sorry.

GUTFELD: So I don't go to church.

PERINO: It's a holiday.

GUTFELD: No -- that's just wrong.

WATTERS: So, yeah, you're going to get it, Greg.

WILLIAMS: But, Jesse, it's a public sidewalk. He's not in the church. It's not in the pews. He can ask the guy -- if the guy doesn't want to answer, he says no comment.

WATTERS: I agree. Listen, I've gotten people coming out of AA meetings.

(CROSSTALK) GUTFELD: See, that's terrible.

WATTERS: I've gotten people in front of their children. I've gotten people on private property.

GUTFELD: So you are worse than this reporter.

WATTERS: But I have never pulled the trigger on something like this on Easter leaving church.

WILLIAMS: Oh, Jesse.

GUTFELD: But thank God you did AA -- you got them outside of AA?

WATTERS: Listen, I was ruthless, I'm not going to lie.

PERINO: Also, you don't work weekends.

WATTERS: I'm not gonna lie.

GUTFELD: That's true.

(LAUGHTER) PERINO: Can I say that --

GUTFELD: I love that they gave you this segment.

(LAUGHTER) WILLIAMS: Well, I mean, just broke it down, though. We needed you to defend the guy. I mean -- I don't know.

PERINO: So, look -- OK, this is one of the reasons I didn't make it in local news.

WATTERS: Why?

PERINO: Because I was asked -- there was a murder trial and I was sent as a young daily reporter and I had to go to the courthouse and I was supposed to ask the woman whose child had been killed right before the trial was supposed to start, I was supposed to get up to her and they said don't come back without an interview. So I got there and I circled three times and then I was like, I'm not doing that.

And I went home and I called my dad and I said I think I just got a degree in something I can't do. So -- but anyway, here I am because it's easier to be here in the studio commenting on people -- reporters out there. I wouldn't have been able to do it, but --

GUTFELD: I think -- I mean, there's a point to that in what you were saying, somewhere.

PERINO: OK.

GUTFELD: But it is -- what we do, we don't never have to be faced with this sort of question every day, and so -- I think you get into a mind-set where you actually don't see what you're doing, right? You're just going out there.

Having said that, I would say the media is a religion in need of a reformation because I think like -- social media is like the Gutenberg press, it's made an untenable situation for everybody -- monopolize truth, right? We now know what's fake and what's real. And so -- it's so easy to call everything out that I think that the media - the media has no respect anymore.

WATTERS: Well, I think the reason why they did this, MSNBC wanted to humiliate Robert Mueller because Rachel Maddow was humiliated herself.

WILLIAMS: Oh! Stop. You know why this is funny to me, because you used to say you liberals, you've made Robert Mueller your hero. So, now after the Mueller Report, after you spin you say oh! Mueller is the hero. MSNBC is attacking Robert Mueller. You know what I think Jesse, this is--

WATTERS: I don't think they attacked him; I just think they nailed him on the street on Easter.

WILLIAMS: This is willful. No, this is people who haven't read the Mueller and engaging in willful ignorance in order to make Mueller their hero. That's what's going on.

WATTERS: I don't think Mueller is a hero. I think it was a horrible report.

WILLIAMS: Why given what you've done in your professional career, are you defending a reporter doing his job on public street.

WATTERS: Juan, I already told you, we had like three rules. Do you want to hear the rest?

GUTFELD: Yes.

WATTERS: No weddings.

GUTFELD: No weddings.

WATTERS: No funerals.

PERINO: OK.

WATTERS: No religious holidays. That's it.

GUTFELD: That's it.

WATTERS: I did everything else.

WILLIAMS: It's weak, Jesse, but go right ahead. Emily.

COMPAGNO: I feel like you know this isn't Mueller with not some Hollywood celebrity where all of a sudden he emerges and it's like what are your thoughts on the allegations that just - I mean he was coming out of Easter service and he already made his point. Like we know what he thought, it was in that report and the fact that they were celebrating also the questions afterwards on MSNBC. Like, yes those are exactly the questions that the public wanted to know. It doesn't matter because you're not going to get any answers.

It was no comment. And I just felt like it must have totally sucked for Mueller to come out. You know when you're like coming off the heels of something so peaceful like yoga or church or something like you--

PERINO: Like check your phone.

COMPAGNO: Too soon you know and then obviously like, like I just feel like way to ruin.

PERINO: Yes. Like I had a facial on Saturday and I get in the car and Peter asked me 20 questions about if I am taking the car with Lauren to get something and he needed the car and I was getting very flustered. He said, What's wrong. Like I just came from a facial where I was like relax and now you ask me 20 questions.

GUTFELD: Do you know the thing that we're overlooking here is that by going after MSNBC we're not going after Brian Stelter and we should be going - what? I didn't know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Trump and his allies are telling big lies. Right now, the most popular one is no obstruction. There is no conspiracy found in the Mueller Report. But there is no integrity either. So, what's the role of the press in this broken environment? In part, our role is to keep collecting facts, all of the facts so that citizens can make up their own minds. But I think it's also our role to stand up for decency and morality. Especially if others won't.

GUTFELD: All right. He is the hairless hall monitor. There is no - he just appointed himself the arbiter of morality after laying the red carpet out for Avenatti, the most amoral vermin since the invention of the cockroach. He embraced Avenatti because he did Stelter's own bidding because he wouldn't do it himself to destroy human being Kavanaugh in order to smear Trump.

So, you can't sit up there on your soapbox because it might break. But you can't sit up there and start lecturing us buddy until you come clean about the mistakes you made.

WATTERS: Up next, Elizabeth Warren unveiling an ambitious big government plan to eliminate student debt. Right next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PERINO: All right. Elizabeth Warren proposing perhaps her biggest policy idea yet. The presidential candidate wants to wipe out student loan debt for 42 million Americans. She explains here how her plan would work.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ELIZABETH WARREN (D-MA) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Anyone who's got outstanding student loan debt can have up to $50,000 worth of student loan debt canceled out so long as their income is under 100,000 then it kind of steps in up to there is no help for anybody whose family income is above 250,000. And that's it. The debt's gone.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: But how about her over trillion-dollar proposal be paid for. Warren wants to use a wealth tax on millionaires and billionaires to cover the cost. Well, I like talking about policy stuff. So, I mean just go around here. She's flooding the zone with policy proposals, Jesse. It's like every day, you can't even catch up with her, because she's throwing all things out there, but in a Granite State Poll today she's at 5 percent. Six months ago, in August, she was at 17 percent. So, she's lost that much ground despite all of these proposals.

WATTERS: Yes. And Mayor Pete and Sanders are surging in that same poll. I like the thought behind this. I don't think Republicans should see this ground to Democrats. Republicans have to come out with an idea of themselves about how to tackle student loan debt because it is an enormous problem in this country. I think her idea behind is unconstitutional. You can't just seize wealth from people. You have to have an income tax. And I don't think she really cares if it's unconstitutional or not. It's more of a PR gimmick for her.

But instead of doing something like that, why don't they create a foundation that large corporations and Americans and other foundations can contribute to tax free and then students with overwhelming debt can then apply to see if they can wipe out some of that debt for them. It has to be done through the private sector because the private sector is the entity that's suffering the most from students with overwhelming debt, because they're not moving out of their parents' basements and going spending any money.

PERINO: And they're defaulting, But Greg could this be the mother of all moral hazards. Right. Because if the only entities that are on the hook are the taxpayers then the costs for college are not going to go down.

GUTFELD: This is theft. Forgiving these debts. This money isn't just disappearing. It's being taken from somebody. Why don't we also do car loans. Why don't we do home loans. My loans to the pawnshop. Right. How is that any different.

WATTERS: My credit cards.

GUTFELD: Yes. Credit card, yes. This does not - and by the way, this doesn't hurt the people you want to hurt, colleges right. They already made the money. You want the colleges with their bloated bureaucracy and infrastructure. You want them to be poked and popped because let's face it. Because the loans were so easy. That's what inflated the infrastructure and inflated the tuition, tripled the tuition in over two decades, it's because they got the money. So, I would - I'm for free college. I want college to be free just so the massive bureaucracies are destroyed and there is a way to do that.

If corporations reject the virtue signaling of advanced degrees and embrace online academia, online colleges could do it. That could be free. Military service, priority over college, just alternative education, trade schools make elite diplomas that cost so much money worthless and that's great, because the problem is the loans were too easy and she's so desperate. She's like a child banging pots and plans in the kitchen. She can't get enough. She wants noise and it's not working.

PERINO: The other thing is Emily that this wasn't detailed in the proposal but that if your debt is forgiven it's like winning a car on a game show.

GUTFELD: Right.

PERINO: You have to pay taxes on that. So then let's say you get $150,000 dollars forgiven, you still have to come up with 25 percent of that in order to pay the tax.

COMPAGNO: Totally. Do you guys remember that scene in 16 Candles where like the grandmother walks in and she opens that donut box with a cigarette. She's like Valla, breakfast is served. That's how I feel like this is. It's a total oversimplification and completely missing the point. So, when she talks about eradicating tuition, what do we think the majority of tuition covers. The pension and remember we've talked about this before the entire pension debacle that states bankruptcies are mired in. So, if she thinks that any type of unions would go for this or that it makes any fiscal economic sense that two plus two equals four, it doesn't in this case.

In California for example, this generation is literally paying for the genius decision of 10 and 20 years ago to eradicate certain extra payments for their pension, whatever. It's basically it's so much more complicated than she's making it seem and its 100 percent doesn't add up. She should incentivize businesses to hire students to have interns to hire employees.

PERINO: It's not like happening under her. But Juan do you think that other Democrats and Biden is going to announce on Wednesday are going to come forward with some sort of a plan like this and doesn't help the people who need it the most.

WILLIAMS: Absolutely. So, Greg was saying he wants to hurt the college, but I think the idea here is to help the students and in specific students who already have accrued substantial debt and are out of school. Their plans are now in places. Some people talking about them, Dana, among Democrats to help in the future, people who would incur future debt, but there is so many people right now struggling with student debt.

And when you think about this whatever she said I think it's by the way her plan is reasonable to my ears. But what strikes me is there is no plan from the Republicans. Right. The Republicans aren't debating it. In fact, it seems to me Republicans have given up on the whole idea of running up crazy tax debts and deficits and all that because Trump has no plan and we see the deficit rising every day.

PERINO: I think--

WILLIAMS: She wants to use this money to help young people who are trying to move ahead. And by the way Greg, those online instant schools, lot of fraud. We just saw recently by the Trump administration pointing out Secretary Davos and others. You've got to look at what's good for young--

GUTFELD: There is a lot of fraud in college. There is a lot of fraud as we can tell.

WILLIAMS: That's what I am saying.

GUTFELD: Other colleges. I think online is the way to go. And I hope that that's what happens.

PERINO: All right. Well, I think - don't tease now. Jussie Smollett's brother making a shocking claim about the troubled actor. Details ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COMPAGNO: Jussie Smollett is still refusing to admit that he staged a hate crime attack. And now his brother is going even further claiming that the disgraced actor is really an assault victim who has been falsely accused by police of making it up. Smollett's brother also saying, "Jussie is as strong as iron. But following an attack like this, there is a normal and natural amount of post-trauma that mostly anyone should expect to suffer. I have literally seen him violently awakening from night terrors following the assault. Some of my siblings as well as Jussie's partner and closest friends have seen similar things."

So what struck me about this in addition to just that ludicrous aspect of it was the fact that if they're trying to start creating a paper trail right now of their being a physical manifestation of damages, if they're laying the groundwork for some type of lawsuit by Jussie Smollett against the city of Chicago, I just hope that they're not. But what do you think, Greg?

GUTFELD: You'd have to have a tremendous number of people involved in this frame up like a 10,000 people. And as someone who actually does experience night terrors otherwise known as hip new gadget nightmares, I experienced them without ever perpetrating a massive hoax which embarrassed your family, your co-workers, people who defended you. So, I can say, go, screw yourself. He has run up his victim debt card. You know everybody has got a little victim debt card. He ran up his, he wants more - he wants to get an extension on his victim card. You're not getting any more victim from me buddy.

WATTERS: He wants Warren to forgive his debt.

GUTFELD: He wants Warren to forgive his debt. By the way, night terrors, they're bad. I have had them.

COMPAGNO: What's the difference between a night terror and like a normal terrible night?

GUTFELD: It's usually sleep paralysis. Sleep paralysis, you feel like you're awake.

WILLIAMS: Oh! My God.

WATTERS: I'm going to see your 16 Candles analogy and I'm going to raise you wedding crashers. Night terrors, that's what that little freaky son Todd had. Remember the artistic weirdo that wanted to play tummy sticks with Vince Vaughn. That doesn't make people feel bad for you, that makes people laugh at you. Don't make - night terrors is when you come home from Iraq and Afghanistan. Not when you come back from subway in Chicago. I'm not going to make a request to make an analogy, because I requested this analogy before.

Smollett is the media. They both perpetuated a hoax. They both got caught and instead of being contrite, they're doubling down on the hoax. These guys just need to lay low. They need to stop having their team write op eds and wait till the thing blows over. Pay Chicago and shut up.

COMPAGNO: I love how - isn't this the brother that Jussie Smollett pretended to be when he was pulled over for DY.

PERINO: OK. Thank you. Yes.

WATTERS: You're right.

PERINO: And also, Kim Foxx 2 X.

COMPAGNO: Yes.

PERINO: She is the one who said in the text message that was revealed last week that he is a liar. She says in the text message he lied to the cops. And also, I would say to the brother that when you - next time you think your brother is having a night terror and you're witnessing it, he's an actor. Right?

COMPAGNO: Totally. Juan, what do you think?

WILLIAMS: I think it's so natural for a brother to stand up for another brother. You know I mean it's his brother and he felt that he should stand up and say you know what, give my brother the benefit of the doubt. And that's the way I looked at it.

PERINO: But at some point, do you say stop?

COMPAGNO: Do you think he believes it though?

WILLIAMS: What did you say?

COMPAGNO: Do you think he believes it, or do you think he's just standing up for him?

WILLIAMS: No. well first of all, I don't know, because I'm not in his head. But I think that Jussie Smollett continues to say that it happened as he says. Now obviously the Chicago Police don't feel that way. Even Charles Barkley don't feel that way.

PERINO: Even Kim Foxx says that.

WILLIAMS: But I'm just saying to you, Jussie Smollett hasn't changed. The police, the prosecution despite - but he's not facing charges. And so, at some point you've got to think why is the system, why is the government continuing to pursue a man who really has been charged with nothing. They had their investigation, no charges.

GUTFELD: Wait, you're talking about Trump?

WILLIAMS: Yes. But there was a mistake.

COMPAGNO: All right, you guys One More Thing is up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUTFELD: One More Thing, Juan.

WILLIAMS: The Easter Bunny was at the center of attention in Orlando last night and it's not because he was throwing chocolate to kids. No, he was throwing knuckles. Take a look at this video. At first folks, he hopped in to break up this fight, but then he gets into the fight throwing punches and he never gets out of costume. My favorite part of this video, his shadow boxing at the very end. It's the Easter Bunny, yes, it's the Easter Bunny as Muhammad Ali. I guess he was just hopping mad folks, hopping mad.

PERINO: Hopping mad.

GUTFELD: Jesse.

WATTERS: OK. So, everybody sent me this video over the weekend, it's of an eight-year-old girl during her AOC impression. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Socialism is so amazing. Like socialism is actually short for social media. Did you know that. Like I was social media, so I'm a socialist, it's like three of the most successful countries in the world are socialist too. Venezuela, Facebook and Twitter. I have a lot of friends who moved to America from Facebook.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATTERS: OK. Her name is Ava Martinez or Ava Martinez. And I mean she does a great impression. I think I should have her on Watters World. What do you think?

GUTFELD: You know what I would not be surprised if you have her on Watters World.

WATTERS: That's definitely happening.

GUTFELD: Me, OK. Here. This is great. Take a look. Animals are great. All right. I love this. Sometimes animals can be real jerks. Take a look at what this elephant did. Came up behind his elephant buddy and said, hey, let me help you. And you could tell if we watch it again you could tell that this was completely premeditated probably said you know what I'm tired of your crap. Get in there. And the thing is what if that elephant couldn't swim and that's attempted murder right there.

But that's why elephants are great. They really are great. Dana?

PERINO: All right, I'm going to raise your Pretty in Pink and Wedding Crashers movies and talk about when Harry Met Sally. But this is when Arden met Stella. Take a look for yourself. So that's Arden, she's the black lab and she got to meet her new little sister Stella for the first time. And she was very excited to get puppy. She's like we've got a puppy. Arden is two years old.

GUTFELD: It's just like the Harry Met Sally dining scene.

PERINO: Arden is a CGC certified, which means that she can be a therapy dog. And that's what the plan is for this new little one as well. So, congratulations Arden. Very cute.

GUTFELD: Yes, I guess so. All right, Emily, it's up to you to finish this show in a good way.

COMPAGNO: OK, which I will because this weekend it was Easter and I wanted to share a few photos with you guys of my family. So here are my three nieces, that's little Leona, Dion eggs and that little Violet Dion eggs as well. And then of course they had to have an egg hunt. So, this is them in the yard. That's little Leona again with her little chicken basket, which I think it's so cute or Bunny basket, whatever that is. And so that's Josephine on the left, Violet in the middle, Leona on the right.

PERINO: Cute kids.

COMPAGNO: So cute.

PERINO: Where was it? It was cold there.

COMPAGNO: Yes, that was in Seattle. That's little Violet with her basket. And then they also went to the tulip festival in Scottsdale.

PERINO: I love that.

COMPAGNO: So, that's a photograph that they took.

PERINO: That's beautiful.

COMPAGNO: And wonderful.

GUTFELD: Are those the tulips?

COMPAGNO: Yes.

GUTFELD: OK.

WATTERS: Happy Earth Day, everybody.

GUTFELD: I'm bringing - I'm going to combine - take your child to work and Earth Day to bring some earth to work day. Everybody bring a pile of dirt and pour it on your boss's desk. How about that?

PERINO: Tomorrow.

GUTFELD: Do it tomorrow. Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of THE FIVE. Special Report is up next. Hey Bret.

BRET BAIER, HOST, SPECIAL REPORT, FOX NEWS: Hi Greg, Happy Earth Day.

GUTFELD: Happy Earth Day.

BAIER: This is a Fox News alert. I'm Brett Baier. House Democrats are throwing down another gauntlet tonight.

END to call everything out that I think that the media - the media has no respect anymore.

WATTERS: Well, I think the reason why they did this, MSNBC wanted to humiliate Robert Mueller because Rachel Maddow was humiliated herself.

WATTERS: I don't think they attacked him; I just think they nailed him on the street on Easter.

WILLIAMS: This is willful. No, this is people who haven't read the Mueller and engaging in willful ignorance in order to make Mueller their hero. That's what's going on.

WATTERS: I don't think Mueller is a hero. I think it was a horrible report.

WILLIAMS: Why given what you've done in your professional career, are you defending a reporter doing his job on public street.

WATTERS: Juan, I already told you, we had like three rules. Do you want to hear the rest?

GUTFELD: Yes.

WATTERS: No weddings.

GUTFELD: No weddings.

WATTERS: No funerals.

PERINO: OK.

WATTERS: No religious holidays. That's it.

GUTFELD: That's it.

WATTERS: I did everything else.

WILLIAMS: It's weak, Jesse, but go right ahead. Emily.

PERINO: Like check your phone.

COMPAGNO: Too soon you know and then obviously like, like I just feel like way to ruin.

GUTFELD: Do you know the thing that we're overlooking here is that by going after MSNBC we're not going after Brian Stelter and we should be going - what? I didn't know.

So, you can't sit up there on your soapbox because it might break. But you can't sit up there and start lecturing us buddy until you come clean about the mistakes you made.

WATTERS: Up next, Elizabeth Warren unveiling an ambitious big government plan to eliminate student debt. Right next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATTERS: My credit cards.

PERINO: The other thing is Emily that this wasn't detailed in the proposal but that if your debt is forgiven it's like winning a car on a game show.

GUTFELD: Right.

PERINO: You have to pay taxes on that. So then let's say you get $150,000 dollars forgiven, you still have to come up with 25 percent of that in order to pay the tax.

PERINO: I think--

GUTFELD: There is a lot of fraud in college. There is a lot of fraud as we can tell.

WILLIAMS: That's what I am saying.

GUTFELD: Other colleges. I think online is the way to go. And I hope that that's what happens.

PERINO: All right. Well, I think - don't tease now. Jussie Smollett's brother making a shocking claim about the troubled actor. Details ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WATTERS: He wants Warren to forgive his debt.

GUTFELD: He wants Warren to forgive his debt. By the way, night terrors, they're bad. I have had them.

COMPAGNO: What's the difference between a night terror and like a normal terrible night?

GUTFELD: It's usually sleep paralysis. Sleep paralysis, you feel like you're awake.

WILLIAMS: Oh! My God.

COMPAGNO: I love how - isn't this the brother that Jussie Smollett pretended to be when he was pulled over for DY.

PERINO: OK. Thank you. Yes.

WATTERS: You're right.

PERINO: And also, Kim Foxx 2 X.

COMPAGNO: Yes.

COMPAGNO: Totally. Juan, what do you think?

PERINO: But at some point, do you say stop?

COMPAGNO: Do you think he believes it though?

WILLIAMS: What did you say?

COMPAGNO: Do you think he believes it, or do you think he's just standing up for him?

PERINO: Even Kim Foxx says that.

GUTFELD: Wait, you're talking about Trump?

WILLIAMS: Yes. But there was a mistake.

COMPAGNO: All right, you guys One More Thing is up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUTFELD: One More Thing, Juan.

PERINO: Hopping mad.

GUTFELD: Jesse.

WATTERS: OK. So, everybody sent me this video over the weekend, it's of an eight-year-old girl during her AOC impression. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATTERS: OK. Her name is Ava Martinez or Ava Martinez. And I mean she does a great impression. I think I should have her on Watters World. What do you think?

GUTFELD: You know what I would not be surprised if you have her on Watters World.

WATTERS: That's definitely happening.

But that's why elephants are great. They really are great. Dana?

GUTFELD: It's just like the Harry Met Sally dining scene.

PERINO: Arden is a CGC certified, which means that she can be a therapy dog. And that's what the plan is for this new little one as well. So, congratulations Arden. Very cute.

GUTFELD: Yes, I guess so. All right, Emily, it's up to you to finish this show in a good way.

PERINO: Cute kids.

COMPAGNO: So cute.

PERINO: Where was it? It was cold there.

COMPAGNO: Yes, that was in Seattle. That's little Violet with her basket. And then they also went to the tulip festival in Scottsdale.

PERINO: I love that.

COMPAGNO: So, that's a photograph that they took.

PERINO: That's beautiful.

COMPAGNO: And wonderful.

GUTFELD: Are those the tulips?

COMPAGNO: Yes.

GUTFELD: OK.

WATTERS: Happy Earth Day, everybody.

GUTFELD: I'm bringing - I'm going to combine - take your child to work and Earth Day to bring some earth to work day. Everybody bring a pile of dirt and pour it on your boss's desk. How about that?

PERINO: Tomorrow.

GUTFELD: Do it tomorrow. Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of "The Five." "Special Report" is up next.

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