Biden economic adviser on coronavirus aid: ‘The cost of inaction is extremely high’

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Biden economic adviser on coronavirus aid: ‘The cost of inaction is extremely high’

Council of Economic Advisers member Jared Bernstein tells ‘Fox News Sunday’ the president is ‘absolutely willing to negotiate’ with Republicans on coronavirus economic relief in order to reach a deal.

This is a rush transcript from "Fox News Sunday" January 31, 2021. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS ANCHOR:  I'm Chris Wallace.

New fears of market fallout as the little guys send a message to Wall
Street and Washington argues over COVID relief.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE (voice-over):  Amateur traders seize on little-known stocks in a
coordinated pushback over what they say is an uneven playing field.

Meanwhile, 16 moderate senators look for common ground on President Biden's
rescue plan for people and businesses hit by the coronavirus.

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES:  We need to make this investment
so the economy can grow.

SEN. JOHN THUNE (R-SD):  I would hold that they would, again, reach out to
Republicans to find common ground.

WALLACE:   We'll ask Jared Bernstein, a top White House economic advisor,
and Republican Bill Cassidy, a member of the Senate's sweet 16, about Wall
Street jitters and the president's COVID rescue plan.

Then, health officials race to vaccinate Americans as new coronavirus
strains keep spreading.

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS
DISEASES:  Viruses cannot mutate if they don't replicate.

WALLACE:  We'll talk with Dr. Tom Inglesby, director of the Johns Hopkins
Center for Health Security, about how much these variants will complicate
efforts to stamp out the virus.

Plus, lawmakers fret over capitol security and the divide in their own
ranks.

REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE:  We will probably need a
supplemental for more security for members when the enemy is within the
House.

WALLACE:  We'll ask our Sunday panel about new tensions inside Congress.

And our "Power Player of the Week," she is opening up new paths for women
in a death-defying sport.

All, right now, on "FOX News Sunday." 

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE (on camera):  And hello again from FOX News in Washington.

Well, markets are anxious and regulators on watch after an online move it
to stick it to Wall Street elites sparked a trading frenzy. This as
President Biden calls for bipartisan support of his massive COVID rescue
package, but at the same time, Democrats in Congress are preparing to move
without Republican votes.

In a moment, we'll speak with Jared Bernstein of the president's Council of
Economic Advisors, and GOP Senator Bill Cassidy, one of the 16 Senate
negotiators.

But, first, let's bring in David Spunt at a snowy White House with the
latest on efforts to shore up the economy -- David.

DAVID SPUNT, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT:  Chris, good morning.

President Biden spent 36 years on Capitol Hill working across the aisle.
Now that he's commander-in-chief, gridlock is his new reality. Add in the
recent stock market chaos, he has a full plate not even two weeks into the
job.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SPUNT (voice-over):  A volatile moment on Wall Street this week.

REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D-NY):  Everyday people were finally able to
collectively organize and get back at the folks who have historically had
all the marbles on Wall Street.

SPUNT:  Thousands of traders drove up prices of stocks like GameStop
creating havoc for brokers who bet about this. The Securities and Exchange
Commission is investigating, but the president and his team, at least
publicly, are mum.

JEN PSAKI, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY:  Our focus and our big story is
getting the American people back to work.

SPUNT:  Back to work with a $1.9 trillion COVID relief package. President
Biden says while he wants Republican support, he'll go it alone if need be.

BIDEN:  The risk is not doing too much. The risk is not doing enough.

SPUNT:  Republicans are pushing for changes.

SEN. BILL CASSIDY (R-LA):  Republicans can be there, but it can't just be
spending $1.9 trillion pulled out of the air with no justification.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SPUNT (on camera):  And with just about a week to go until former President
Trump's impeachment trial, Chris, we learned last night, his entire legal
team quit, all five attorneys, leaving his legal strategy unknown -- Chris.

WALLACE:  David Spunt reporting from the White House -- David, thank you.

And joining us now, Jared Bernstein of the president's Council of Economic
Advisors.

Jared, the biggest complaint about the president's $1.9 trillion COVID
rescue package is that it's just too big. I want to put some items up on
the screen.

You would give $1,400 -- $1,400 checks to someone who's making $75,000 a
year and has kept his job. Hundreds of billions of dollars already approved
by Congress haven't been spent yet, and there's money for things that have
nothing to do with COVID like $20 billion for mass transit and raising the
minimum wage.

Now, ten Republican senators say that come up with a compromise plan and
have asked for a meeting with President Biden.

First of all, your initial reaction to what those were Republican senators
are calling for? And secondly, is President Biden willing to come down from
the $1.9 trillion price tag?

JARED BERNSTEIN, COUNCIL OF ECONOMIC ADVISERS:  Thank you, Chris. Great to
be with you.

We just learned about this letter from the Republicans a few minutes ago,
but the president has consistently said three things.

One, he is absolutely willing to negotiate.

Two, and this speaks to your question, this plan is scaled to have the
punch to finally put these dual crises behind us, to meet the challenge of
vaccine distribution, of virus control and of meeting economic relief
that's so urgent in this moment. The cost of inaction is extremely high.

Part three is, as I mentioned, willing to negotiate with Republicans and
glad to hear from this letter that they're on board, but we need to learn a
lot more about it.

Right now, we are in a position where delay and inaction are the enemy of
moving forward.

WALLACE:  But just to be clear, when you say he is willing to negotiate,
it's clear Bill Cassidy, we'll hear from him a little bit more in the next
segment, he's one of the ten Republican senators, President Biden is
willing to come down from the $1.9 trillion?

BERNSTEIN:  President Biden has consistently said he will negotiate with --
with those on the other side of the aisle about getting this plan out as
quickly as possible. What's so urgent here is getting relief to the
American people and finally gaining control of the virus.

I think the way to think about this less than the top line number is the
following: delay, inaction, failure to negotiate, wait and see, these have
been the enemies of virus control, of vaccine distribution and the arrival
of a robust, inclusive, and racially equitable recovery.

And the president is willing to negotiate with everyone who signs up for
the urgency of that plan.

WALLACE:  Let me follow up on that because the president talks a lot about
bipartisanship, but at the same time, Democrats in the House and Senate are
already working on a budget which if they pass it would allow -- not saying
it would happen -- but would allow them to pass a -- this COVID relief
package on a straight party line vote, just the 50 Democrats plus Vice
President Kamala Harris in the Senate.

So which is more important to the president, bipartisanship, unity, or
getting it passed now?

BERNSTEIN:  I don't think it's an either/or kind of a choice.

Look, the American people really couldn't care less about budget process,
whether it's regular order, bipartisanship, whether it's filibuster,
whether it's reconciliation, they need relief and they need it now.

And I think what's so key here -- and the package is scaled to meet the
costs that I'm about to articulate. If we don't get this package as
designed out the door quickly, we risk having 4 million fewer jobs at the
end of this year, that's from Moody’s. We risk taking a year or longer
to get to full employment.

Kids who were out of school every year, that costs their lifetime earnings
north of 5 percent. That's a permanent ding on their ability to prosper
throughout their lives.

There are 11 million people unemployed. The African-American on employment
rate is double digits, so the urgency here is the cost of inaction.

And the plan is scaled to finally meet the challenge and the reason we had
a negative employment report in December, the reason consumer spending, 70
percent of this economy, was November -- was negative in November and
December is because we allowed an economic air pocket to deliver by not
getting ahead of the virus.

And this plan is the first plan I've seen -- 

WALLACE:  Right.

BERNSTEIN:  -- that we'll get ahead of this virus and finally put it in the
-- in the rearview mirror.

WALLACE:  Jared, you talk about a fairly dismal short-term economic
picture, particularly if you don't get the COVID relief plan, which raises
a question a lot of critics are asking -- why would President Biden be
pushing a climate change agenda now?

I want to put up some of the things he did this week. He killed the
Keystone pipeline, which backers say will cost 11,000 jobs short-term, and
he announced a moratorium on new oil and gas leases on public lands.

Does it make sense to be killing jobs at a time when 18 million Americans
are unemployed?

BERNSTEIN:  So I definitely, completely reject the framing of the question.
You know, let me go back -- it was a campaign line but it was one that had
real economic substance, and this was when the president-elect at the time
-- I'm sorry, the vice president at the time was arguing that when his
opponent, former President Trump, hears climate change, he thinks hoax.
When Biden hears it, he thinks jobs.

Not only are there many more jobs in the climate agenda -- and this will be
more part of the Recovery Act that's coming later than the rescue plan --
but this is something where the market is already moving in this direction
and our plans -- you know, think of the announcement this week from General
Motors to move towards -- towards battery-powered vehicles.

This is -- this is us really picking up and trying to amplify where the
market is going anyway and it's a walk and chew gum moment. I mean, this
president won a decisive victory in part because of pledging to take such a
vital action on climate. And I firmly believe that this is a pro-growth
plan. It also has to occur as we take the steps to finally get to a robust
recovery when we can start building our clean energy industries.

WALLACE:  But, Jared, I mean, the fact is the Keystone pipeline is going to
kill 11,000 jobs, a thousand right now already, 10,000 that were planned.
And that's the argument that critics make. They say you're killing current
good-paying jobs for the prospect of jobs down the line.

Here is the governor of Montana this week.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GREG GIANFORTE (R), MONTANA:  This Keystone XL pipeline is a lifeline for
rural Montana. It would have generated over $100 million a year in taxes to
help us pay for schools, law enforcement, infrastructure. This is
devastating.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE:  The governor says that when the president signed that executive
order, the workers on the Keystone pipeline packed up their lunch pails and
went home.

BERNSTEIN:  Look, we haven't had the Keystone pipeline in place for a long
time and we certainly had, you know, a very low unemployment rate before
the crisis hit.

The key to getting back to robust job opportunities is to cease any delay,
any inaction, any failure to negotiate, any wait-and-see around us rescue
plan because this rescue plan is of a magnitude -- and that's so important
because you question the top line number -- is of a magnitude to get us to
the other side of this fiscal crisis so we can finally and reliably launch
a robust economic recovery.

Now, you don't get there without virus control and key to the American
Rescue Plan is not just virus control, but it's vaccine distribution. So if
we take the steps the president has outlined, we will begin to see the
unemployment rate fall more quickly, as I said. One estimate gets us to
full employment a year earlier, 4 million more jobs, if we pass this plan
against if we don't.

So I think that in terms of job availability, robust labor demand and
economic opportunity, the American Rescue Plan is precisely the right
medicine.

WALLACE:  Finally, and I want to switch subjects on you, we got about a
minute left, Jared.

There's been a lot of talk this week -- as I'm sure you've heard about
GameStop and the big turbulence in the stock market. The White House has
really tried to stay out of this and kept referring things to the SEC.

But here is Democratic Senator Elizabeth Warren this week. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ELIZABETH WARREN (D-MA):  When you don't have an honest market, a lot
of folks get cheated and a lot more folks just say I'm not going into a
market like that. I'm not going to participate. I'm not going to put my
money out there.

WALLACE:  I'm really asking you, you talk a lot about the economy, is the
president concerned about market manipulation, whether it's from hedge
funds, whether it's from retail investors and exactly what Elizabeth Warren
was talking about, that it hurts the economy because it reduces public
confidence in the markets?

BERNSTEIN:  Well, first of all, the president recognizes the stock market
is not the real economy faced by so many people on the bottom leg of this
K-shaped recovery. They depend on the American Rescue Plan to deliver both
virus control, vaccine distribution, and economic relief.

As far as GameStop, I think the president's main concern there is that the
regulator in charge, the SEC, Securities and Exchange Commission, has to
make sure not that there's no volatility and speculation in the market,
that's a constant, but that the underlying plumbing of the financial
markets remains sound. That's the job of the SEC, and if you read their
statements, you'll find that they are very much on that case.

I think that from the perspective of Senator Warren, who I always listen
very carefully to what she's talking about that, really her thematic there
is that we're in a situation where the stock market has been going up and
poverty has been rising and food pantries are facing massive demand,
families face hunger. About three -- about 30 million of them, they face
evictions. They're trying to keep a house over their head.

That's where the American Rescue Plan comes in and that's where the
president's focus is 100 percent on that issue.

WALLACE:  Jared, we're going to have to leave it there. Thank you. Thanks
for your time this week, and please come back.

BERNSTEIN:  My pleasure.

WALLACE:  Up next, President Biden continues to chop away at Trump policies
with executive actions and orders. We'll ask Republican Senator Bill
Cassidy what that means for bipartisan support of the Biden agenda. That's
next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WALLACE:  We're just 11 days into the new administration and partisan
cracks are already appearing in talks over a massive COVID relief package.
 
Now Democrats are preparing to possibly go it alone.
 
Joining us, a member of the centrist group called the Sweet 16, Louisiana
Senator Bill Cassidy. And Senator, welcome back.
 
SEN. BILL CASSIDY, (R-LA):  OK. Thank you.
 
WALLACE: So as we mentioned, the Biden White House has been reaching out to
this group, the so-called Sweet 16's, eight Republican senators, eight
Democratic senators, trying to negotiate a bipartisan compromise but just
today, just in the last hour, ten Republican senators, including you, say
you've come out with your own compromise plan and have asked for a meeting
with President Biden.
 
First of all, your reaction to what you heard from Jared Bernstein just
now. And secondly, give us a sense of this plan and how much it would come
down from that $1.9 trillion price tag the president's asking for?
 
CASSIDY:  First, let me correct a couple things. The president's team did
not reach out to anybody in our group either Democrat or Republican when
they fashioned their proposal. So if you want unity, if you want
bipartisanship, you ought to start with the group that's shown it's willing
to work together for a common solution. They did not.
 
Secondly, ours is about $600 billion. As opposed to the extraneous things,
which Mr. Bernstein kind of tried to glide over, we are very targeted.
We're targeted to the needs of the American people, treating our tax
dollars as if they're our tax dollars and putting it where we need to come
out of the pandemic.
 
Now, we think there's a lot here to work for -- to work with. We hope we
finally start getting that bipartisan -- and with the White House
negotiation. So far we've received it.
 
WALLACE: So 600 billion, while it's real money, is a lot different than 1.9
trillion. Give me the biggest ticket items that you would include from the
president's package and a couple of big items that you would exclude?
 
CASSIDY:  So we have $160 billion. We match his figure when it comes to
vaccination. To increase capacity to make more vaccine more quickly as well
as to adapt to these variants which are coming across.
 
One area that we decrease, he has 170 billion for schools. Now, we've
already given schools 110 percent of what they usually receive from the
federal government. Parochial schools have opened with a fraction of that
money, charter schools are opened.
 
The real problem is public schools. That issue is not money. That issue is
teachers' unions telling their teachers not to go to work. And putting 170
billion towards teachers' unions priorities takes care of a Democratic
constituency group but it wastes our federal taxpayer dollars for something
which is not the problem.
 
We have 20 billion to get kids back to school on top of the roughly 66
billion which is on top of the 57 billion schools normally get. We can get
kids back to school without kind of bailing out the teachers unions.
 
WALLACE:  And real quickly, the president calling for $1,400 paychecks for
everybody who makes $75,000 a year or less, does that stay or no?
 
CASSIDY:  Yes. Ours is targeted. We have $1,000 and it begins to phase out.
If you notice, there's been very good analysis that above a certain income
level, that money's not spent.
 
Now it may pay down debt and we've seen credit card delinquency go down,
mortgage delinquency go down, savings rates go up. But that doesn't
stimulate the economy, it's good but it doesn't stimulate the economy. Our
money goes to that income level where we know it will stimulate the economy
and theoretically that's what they actually want.
 
WALLACE:  For all the president's talk about unity and bipartisanship, he
indicated what his top priority is on Friday. Take a look.
 
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
 
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES:   I support passing COVID relief
with support from republicans if we can get it, but the COVID relief has to
pass. There's no ifs, ands or buts.
 
(END VIDEO CLIP)
 
WALLACE:  Senator, do you see the Democrats already working on a budget
that, as I discussed with Jared Bernstein, would allow them to pass COVID
relief on a straight party line vote through this process called
reconciliation in the Senate; do you see them already starting already to
work on that budget in a sign of bad faith?
 
CASSIDY:  Well, first, they've never reached out to us. So that's the
beginning of the bad faith. On the other hand, of course.
 
If you say you want bipartisanship and you want unity and you want
Republicans to join and then you have a budget reconciliation, which is
chock-full of handouts and payoffs to Democratic constituency groups -- and
by the way, policies which will kill millions of jobs, which is what CBO
says raising minimum wage to $15 would do in normal times, nothing like
today -- you don't want bipartisanship.
 
You want the patina of bipartisanship what you want to stick it and ram it
through. So that's not unity.
 
WALLACE:  You heard my discussion with Mr. Bernstein about the decision of
the president and his executive actions to kill the Keystone Pipeline, to
impose a moratorium on oil and gas leasing in public lands.
 
That clearly would hit a state like -- an oil-producing state like your
home state of Louisiana hard. But John Kerry, one of the president's top
climate advisors, said this week that weaning the country off of fossil
fuel production like coal and oil is not only good for the environment but
is also good for workers in those industries.
 
Take a look, Senator.
 
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
 
JOHN KERRY, SPECIAL PRESIDENTIAL ENVOY ON CLIMATE CHANGE:  Coal plants have
been closing over the last 20 years. So what President Biden wants to do is
make sure those folks have better choices, that they have alternatives,
that they can be the people who go to work to make the solar panels.
 
(END VIDEO CLIP)
 
WALLACE: Does Senator -- Secretary Kerry, does he have a point, green
energy jobs are some of the fastest growing in the country?
 
CASSIDY: So we've heard this before from President Obama, when he first got
inaugurated green energy was going to take care of anything. What kept us
out of a terrible -- the recession -- it was bad, but kept us kind of
emerged, was fracking. It wasn't green energy.
 
We've heard this before and if you think about the picture of the person
who just laid off 11 people and he is in front of his half completed home,
this was in USA Today, and he doesn't know how he will complete it, it's
because Keystone XL is canceled today.
 
These jobs on the by-and-by which may occur in another state with different
training years down the road, pretty cold comfort for someone losing their
job. And what Mr. Kerry ignores, see this covering, it's plastic. That
plastic is made from fossil fuel.
 
Yes, coal plants have been closing, but natural gas plants have been
opening. Because of those natural gas plants, we have cheap plastics, cheap
consumer goods, and our nation's greenhouse gas emissions are lower now
than they were in 2005. Not because of renewable, small fraction, because
of cheap, abundant natural gas.
 
These are wrongheaded policies which are going to cost jobs now. They speak
like economists, not like somebody that looks in the eye of a worker who
doesn't know how he will pay his rent or pay his mortgage.
 
WALLACE: Senator, finally -- and I've got less than two minutes -- the
impeachment trial starts a week from tomorrow. And as we reported earlier,
we just learned that the president has split with his legal team reportedly
because he wanted them to focus on the fact that -- his claim that the
election was stolen, they wanted to talk about the fact that they think
that the whole trial is unconstitutional for a former president.
 
One, what do you think of the idea of that as a defense for the president,
arguing that the election was stolen? And secondly, what is it going to do
to the trial if the president eight days before it starts doesn't even have
a group of lawyers?
 
CASSIDY: I have no clue. I have said already, as I did a year ago, that I
will wait to judge based upon the evidence presented. And the evidence is,
as I understand, going to focus on whether or not the president contributed
to an atmosphere to have people charged the Capitol, break-in, threatening,
if you will, both members of Congress and Vice President Pence. That's the
charge.
 
So I would hope that whatever defense is put up refutes that charge. But
again, I will wait to judge based upon the evidence which is presented.
 
WALLACE: Do you think that there should be a delay in the trial now that
the president doesn't have a legal team?
 
CASSIDY: Chris, I'm not quite sure. This is obviously uncharted territories
for multiple reasons. I always thought the president had insufficient time
to come up with a rebuttal. This makes it perhaps even more insufficient.
But in a sense, it might be the president, I don't know that for sure, who
has contributed to this so I think this needs to be worked out.
 
There's probably better ways to handle it than we currently are. I hope
those are explored.
 
WALLACE: Senator, thank you. Thanks for joining us this Sunday, always good
to talk with you, sir.
 
CASSIDY: Thank you, Chris.
 
WALLACE:  Coming up, the White House ramps up the vaccine rollout, but
there are growing concerns about virus mutations. We'll ask a top public
health expert about the latest front in a fight against COVID.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WALLACE:  Coming up, President Biden promises more shipments of vaccines
while still warning of pain to come.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN:  The brutal truth is it's going to take months before we get the
majority of Americans vaccinated. Months.



930
CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: More shipments of vaccines while still
warning of pain to come.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The brutal truth is, it's going
to take months before you get the majority of Americans vaccinated. Months.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: We'll talk to a public health expert about the White House
timeline for containing the virus. 

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WALLACE: We may soon see a third COVID vaccine get emergency approval, but
it is not as effective as the two existing vaccines.

For the latest on the continuing fight against COVID, we turn to Dr. Tom
Inglesby, director of the Center for Health Security at Johns Hopkins.

Doctor, how concerned are you about the variants to the virus and the
possibility -- like the South African variant, and the possibility that as
the virus begins to spread, we could end up with a strain that is just
resistant to the vaccines, that the vaccines won't protect us against?

DR. TOM INGLESBY, JOHNS HOPKINS BLOOMBERG SCHOOL OF PUBLIC HEALTH: Well,
good morning, Chris.

I am concerned about the arrival of the variants in the United States.
Certainly it's -- it's something that we all need to be taking very
seriously.

I think at this point the good news is that the vaccines that we have
appear to be still very effective against this vaccine and the companies
and our government scientists are looking very closely at it and are
developing the possibility of boosters that would more tightly address this
new variant if we need to go in that direction. But I think it's a message
to all Americans that what happens elsewhere in the world can affect us and
that we need do everything we can to control this pandemic.

This virus is going to continue to mutate as it -- as long as it's allowed
to thrive in the world and we need to do what we can to contain it.

WALLACE: And -- and -- and just give us a sense, because as it mutates,
what are the chances that we end up with a variant that is totally
resistant to the vaccine?

INGLESBY: Just difficult to -- to make estimates of the probability of that
happening, but what we're seeing is that in the South African variant, the
variance that was first found in South Africa, that at least in mild to
moderate disease, some of the -- of the vaccine studies are showing
diminished effectiveness. It looks like we still have enough cushion with
the vaccines that they will still be very effective at this point, but it's
a message that's saying that this virus is evolving and could continue to
evolve in ways that make it more dangerous, either more transmissible or
more lethal. And so it's important again for us to really do what we can to
try and contain this virus, wear masks, avoid social gatherings, decrease
social interaction until we get this under control. And certainly, if you
have a chance to get vaccinated, if you're eligible for a vaccine, you
should get vaccinated in the larger effort to control this virus. 

WALLACE: Well, let's talk about vaccine.

Johnson & Johnson has announced that it has a single-dose vaccine and that
it may apply for emergency approval from the FDA as soon as this week. The
kicker is that it says that the efficacy rate is 72 percent for its J&J
vaccine, as opposed to Pfizer and Moderna, which have an efficacy rate of
94 to 95 percent.

I guess the question is, if you had a choice -- and I'm not sure you will -
- but if you had a choice, why would you take the 72 percent vaccine rather
than the 94 or 95 percent vaccine?

INGLESBY: Well, first of all, I think this is an amazing development to
have a third vaccine that is highly effective against this virus. So I
think it's very welcome news for the world and for the U.S.

I think the vaccine studies were set up in a different way. The Moderna,
Pfizer vaccine studies happen before we had the variants circulating widely
in the world. And the J&J vaccine study looked at disease end points that
went out a bit further, at least were -- have been reported further out.
And we see that in mild-to-moderate disease, the J&J vaccine was, as you
say, 72 percent. But as you go further out in time, you see that with --
after 28 days, it's 85 percent protective against all strains and there
were no cases of severe disease or death after 49 days after vaccination.

We need to see more about the J&J vaccine. So we've only seen the press
release. We need -- the FDA needs to review it, see the details. But I
think it's -- it's promising early information and I'm hopeful that we'll
see it -- we'll see it as a very effective vaccine as part of our overall
strategy.

WALLACE: You were, I think it's fair to say, pretty critical of the Trump
administration's handling of this whole pandemic. Now that Joe Biden is in
charge, what are you most encouraged by in the way he's handling the whole
COVID issue, and are there some issue -- some areas of the way that his new
administration is handling this that still give you concern?

INGLESBY: So I think, first of all, we're only about ten days into this, so
it's difficult to say. But what I'm seeing in the first ten days is really
encouraging to me. I think we've seen a very substantial and detailed
strategy around vaccination that's been released. FEMA has been giving out
money to states for vaccination -- for the vaccination program. New -- new
rules were passed to allow doctors and nurses to -- who have retired to --
to vaccinate as part of the program. We're seeing increased rates of
vaccinations. So if you look back two weeks ago, about 700,000 to 800,000
doses a day were being given out. Now we're up to 1.2 million to 1.3
million doses a day. We have some forecasting over the next three weeks
that we'll have more vaccine available, 16 percent more vaccine available
in the next few weeks. So, overall, I am -- I am very encouraged by what I
see. I see scientists now they're promising three days a week, press
conference from CDC director and the NIH director and others involved.

WALLACE: Right.

INGLESBY: So I think what we're seeing is very encouraging.

WALLACE: One of the biggest issues, I think it's fair to say, is schools
and there are number of school districts around the country that still
haven't gone back to in-person learning.

What is the science, Doctor? Are kids safer in school or outside in the
community? And what about the teachers and their teacher unions around the
country that are refusing to go back to in person teaching?

INGLESBY: So I think the science is showing that if schools have very
strong mitigation procedures in place, if they've reduce the density within
the school, and they're taking all of those measures very seriously, then
schools can operate safely as long as the community prevalence of the
disease around them is not overwhelming. And so that's really encouraging
news.

But what we see is that schools that have resources can put those things in
place and that many schools in the country have not been able to put those
things into place. So that would make them a less safe environment for both
the students and the teachers. So what we need to do is bring up all
schools to a certain level of capability so that they can mitigate the
risks, they can have good ventilation for kids and for teachers, they can
de-densify the classroom so that kids can operate -- can -- can be there
more safely and teachers can operate more safely.

I think it's very encouraging that teachers are in the front of the line to
get vaccinated and I hope that teachers around the country are able to get
vaccinated in the coming days if they haven't been already. That will --
that will really help reduce the risk to the adult population in schools.

But I do think there's a lot of work to do in a lot of schools that do not
have the things that the better prepared schools now have in place. So I
think that's the challenge for us now, bringing schools around the country
up to that level of capability to make it safer.

WALLACE: Dr. Inglesby, thank you. Thanks for coming in today. It's always
good to talk with you, sir.

INGLESBY: Thanks so much, Chris.

WALLACE: Up next, as lawmakers beef up security on Capitol Hill, there are
new accusations of violent rhetoric about each other. We'll bring in our
Sunday group to discuss unprecedented tensions inside the halls of
Congress. 

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): The enemy is within the House of Representatives.
A threat that members are concerned about in addition to what is happening
outside.

REP. MARJORY TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA) (2019): How did you get over 30
appointments with senators? How'd you do that? How did you get major press
coverage on this issue?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: Speaker Pelosi pointing the finger at some of her colleagues in
the House and a clip from 2019 showing new Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor
Greene harassing David Hogg, the student who survived the Parkland school
massacre.

And it's time now for our Sunday group.

Guy Benson of Fox News Radio, Susan Page from "USA Today," and Harold Ford,
Jr., the CEO of Empowerment and Inclusion Capital.

Well, House Republican Leader Kevin McCarthy is going to be meeting with
Congresswoman Greene this week about her past actions and statements.

Guy, how big a problem is Greene for the GOP?

GUY BENSON, TOWNHALL.COM AND FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Chris, this is not how
Republican leadership had the early days of the Biden administration sort
of drawn up in their minds I would imagine. They want to unify the party,
they want to unify their caucus in the House and they've gained a lot of
seats, of course, in the 2020 election and put that unified front up
against the Democrats and -- and try to win some votes here, make the
Democrats' lives more difficult. And, instead, there's just this deluge of
opposition research that's coming out against this woman from -- from
Georgia, this member of Congress who has said a lot of absolutely insane,
crazy things and has apparently spouted or embraced or amplified every
conspiracy theory in the book.

So McCarthy has a tough task this week because I think a lot of people in
the conference have had enough of all of these news cycles. They think that
she's reckless and a huge liability for the party. But she just had a
conversation with President Trump, according to her Twitter feed, over the
weekend, where she pledged full support for him and vice versa. And
Republican voters are still hugely supportive of President Trump. So it's -
- it's a headache, a very big headache for Republican leadership.

WALLACE: Harold, you were a member of Congress for ten years. And, of
course, it's not unusual to see sharp disagreements over policy. But what
does it mean for the House when you have members literally afraid of other
members and fearing for their physical safety?

HAROLD FORD JR., FORMER CONGRESSMAN (D-TN) AND CEO, EMPOWERMENT AND
INCLUSION CAPITAL: First off, thanks for having me on.

I think just asking the question and even listening to Guy's answer
confirms that we're not living in normal times.

I think the Republican Party -- and Democrats have gone through this in the
past as well but in different ways -- the Republican Party's trying to --
trying to move to a face that -- that Guy tried to outline. Instead, it's
one now that seems to be a grievance and conspiracy theories.

I recall when I was in Congress, Republicans, the face of the party was
strong defense, fiscal restraint, limited government. I think democracy is
served better when you have two parties that are strong and dynamic and
inspiring. And, unfortunately for Republicans, that's not where they are
right now. I naturally like -- I like to think my party has better ideas,
but you -- you -- you can't have a robust debate unless both parties are
strong in -- in a huge way.

I hope the Republicans find their way again. It's obvious that his
congresswoman, she's a little off. I mean some of these conspiracy
theories, even Guy for -- neglected to mention, she believed that the
Clintons killed JFK Jr. to prevent JFK Jr. from running against Hillary.

So I hope we can move away from that and find our way back to the kind of
debate we heard earlier on the show between Cassidy and Bernstein.

WALLACE: Susan, you know, you've got a situation right now where there is
more visible outrage inside the GOP over Liz Cheney, a member of
leadership, voting to impeach the president, over -- rather than some of
these wild conspiracy theories being espoused by Marjorie Taylor Greene.

How serious is this for the GOP and what can they do about it? I mean they
take her off committees? Expel her? What -- what -- what are their options
here?

SUSAN PAGE, "USA TODAY": Well, I -- I -- I think you're right, I think it
tells you a lot about where the Republican Party is right now that Liz
Cheney is undoubtedly going to face a primary fight the next time she's up
for election, that she has -- there is at least a possibility that she is
going to lose her place in the House leadership because of this vote of
conscience she took. While Republicans in private expressed concern about
Marjorie Taylor Greene, not many of them are willing to speak up in public.
And the toughest punishment that is being seriously considered is taking
her off the Education Committee, which is something I think that probably
is not even a slap on the wrist, doesn't do anything to stop her from
espousing views.

You know, you think about-- there are big wounds on Capitol Hill from the
January 6th assault on Congress. That's what you heard from Nancy Pelosi
when she was talking to reporters in the clip you played. There is -- this
is a kind of language we have not heard from Capitol Hill since the Civil
War, and it's not over yet.

WALLACE: And then there is Donald Trump's continuing hold on the Republican
Party.

Here was the Republican leader in the House, Kevin McCarthy, a couple of
weeks ago when he voted against the -- the -- the House's decision to
impeach Donald Trump, but still called him out.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): The president bears responsibility for
Wednesday's attack on Congress by mob rioters. He should have immediately
denounced the mob when he saw what was unfolding.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: But, this week, McCarthy met with Mr. Trump at Mar-a-Lago and
issued a statement that the president will campaign for Republicans in the
'22 -- 2022 midterm elections.

Guy, is Mr. Trump's role in the Capitol attack on January 6th effectively -
- has it effectively been forgotten by the Republican Party on Capitol
Hill?

BENSON: The Republican Party on Capitol Hill is trying to figure out what
the hell to do about him, and they don't know. And this goes, I think, back
to some of the paralysis that I just mentioned in my previous answer.
President Trump, and I know a lot of people are frustrated by this fact,
and some people in the press can't believe it, but President Trump remains
the most popular and most influential Republican in the country. And it's
not even close when you look at Republican voters.

The struggle is for the party, independents and people that they need to
bring back into their coalition to win the House back in 2022, to win the
Senate back in 2022, they have moved further away from President Trump.
There's a lot of very interesting polling data out yesterday, or at least
over the weekend from Georgia, which shows that Trump still has 85 percent
support among GOP voters, but he's -- he's underwater significantly
statewide in what has been traditionally a red state. It's sort of this --
this rock and a hard place situation for the Republican Party where it's
kind of a lose-lose and they're not sure where to go, what to do.

WALLACE: Well, Harold, let me pick up on that as a matter of practical
politics.

Can Republicans write off, not only the former president, but the tens of -
- of millions of Americans who voted for him on November 3rd and would vote
for him again?

FORD: I think the real issue here is that the Republicans are afraid and
the Congress and the Senate are -- are afraid about primary contests.
Remember, Donald Trump lost the election to Joe Biden by more than --
almost 7 million votes. He may retain some popularity, but this week we
learned that Rob Portman is not going to run again. I think we can all read
a lot of things into that. I served with both Rob and Pat Toomey. Pat
Toomey's not running again.

And I think the question becomes -- and I've watched Kevin McCarthy in Palm
Beach with the president. It was clear to me that neither of them quite
know where the party's going but they're -- they appear to -- appear likely
to want to do it together. The question for Republicans, are you more
worried about primaries or are you more worried about winning general
elections and winning back independent voters. That's the choice they have
to make. And I hope they make the right one for themselves and I hope they
make the right one for the country because, again, a dynamic two-party
system is important for good policymaking and good politics to emerge.

WALLACE: And in about 30 seconds, Susan, what's the answer to the question,
which are Republicans more concerned about, primaries or general elections?

PAGE: Well, House Republicans are more concerned about primaries and I
think Senate Republicans may be more concerned about general elections.
It's kind of the nature of the races in which they won.

Right now Donald Trump continues to be the loudest voice in the Republican
Party. Will that be true in 18 months or in two years? I don't think we
know.

WALLACE: Well, all right, we're going to leave it there. Thank you, panel,
see -- see you next Sunday.

Up next, our "Power Player of the Week," Emily Harrington, on her record-
breaking climb and embracing fear. Look at that. 

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WALLACE: She's one of the top-ranked competitors in a sport that's as
fascinating as it is frightening. And she just set a new record on a
classic course.

Here's our "Power Player of the Week."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

EMILY HARRINGTON, PROFESSIONAL ROCK CLIMBER: I was drawn to the challenge.
I was drawn to the exposure. I was drawn to the fear.

WALLACE: Emily Harrington faces fear in a way few others have. Free
climbing rock walls, using just her hands and feet, with a rope only in
case she falls.

WALLACE (on camera): You talk about the -- the -- the place of fear and
discomfort. I think most people would say they -- they spend their life
trying to avoid that. You spend your life seeking it.

HARRINGTON: I think we, as humans, spend too much time avoiding those --
those harder feelings. Those are very normal, natural human emotions that
nobody can ever escape.

WALLACE (voice over): Last fall Emily became the first woman to free climb
the Golden Gate Route up Yosemite's famed El Capitan in less than 24 hours.

It's a punishing 3,200 foot assent that usually takes days.

HARRINGTON: It is one of the most difficult, massive and beautiful walls in
the world, and it's sort of a bucket list thing on every climbers list.

WALLACE (on camera): What is so special about the Golden Gate Route in 24
hours?
 
HARRINGTON: Yes, it was just this massive challenge of having everything
that I have worked my entire life on just all rolled into 24 hours.

WALLACE (voice over): It didn't come easy.

HARRINGTON: The second attempt, I was really close. I failed about 300 feet
from the top. I was to tired -- essentially like my arms were just giving
out on me.

HARRINGTON: I just thought I could do it and --

WALLACE (on camera): You did And then I decided to try again last year, my
third time, and I actually slipped in the very, very 2,900 feet, you're 300
feet from the summit, and you can't go any further.

HARRINGTON: Yes.
 
WALLACE: How frustrating was that?
 
HARRINGTON: And there were a lot of tear. There's a little bit of
profanity.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is today the day?

HARRINGTON: Today's the day.

WALLACE (voice over): But this November, she was back.

WALLACE (on camera): What is it like starting out to climb El Capitan at
1:30 in the morning?
 
HARRINGTON: It's really peaceful. It's a really cool experience. You have
your head lamp and it's just you and your little circle of light.

WALLACE (voice over): Emily was doing well, until --

HARRINGTON: And I started up this one pitch and I slipped and I fell. And
then the next thing I knew, I saw black and I just felt like the wetness of
blood pouring down my face.

WALLACE (on camera): And how close did you come to giving up at that
moment?
 
HARRINGTON: I really did want to quit and I told myself, OK, I'm going to
try one more time and I'm going to focus just on what's in front of me.

WALLACE (voice over): Emily kept climbing. And this time she made it.

HARRINGTON: It was now 10:00 at night. I was very, very tired. And I just
cried. And kind of a little bit sad that it was over, honestly.

WALLACE (on camera): How long had you been climbing that day?
 
HARRINGTON: Twenty-one hours, 13 minutes and 51 seconds.
 
WALLACE (voice over): Emily Harrington has been the first woman to make 14
assents. Each one a chance to face fear and beat it.

HARRINGTON: I have tons of projects out there that I haven't yet succeeded
on. And every once in a while, when you succeed, it really is like a gift
(ph).

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE: Filmmaker Jon Glassberg shot much of that remarkable footage. Look
for his documentary about Emily's climb this fall.

And that's it for today. Have a great week and we'll see you next FOX NEWS
SUNDAY.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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